Know Thyself

Nothing in Excess
 
HomePortalFAQMemberlistSearchRegisterLog in

Share | 
 

 Jonathan Bowden

View previous topic View next topic Go down 
AuthorMessage
Cold Weasel

avatar

Gender : Male Aquarius Posts : 256
Join date : 2012-05-25
Age : 32
Location : East via West

PostSubject: Jonathan Bowden Thu Dec 20, 2012 8:01 am

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
Back to top Go down
View user profile
apaosha
Daeva
avatar

Gender : Male Virgo Posts : 1495
Join date : 2009-08-24
Age : 30
Location : Ireland

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Thu Dec 20, 2012 9:04 am

Interesting. Great symbolism.

I also liked his talk on Evola.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

_________________
"I do not exhort you to work but to battle; I do not exhort you to peace but to victory. May your work be a battle; may your peace be a victory." -TSZ
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://knowthyself.forumotion.net
Guest
Guest



PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Thu Dec 20, 2012 8:30 pm

I claimed on here, that I cannot watch (access) certain youtube vids in Germany. I cannot access the "Venus Flytrap" vid.

It says "this video is not available in your country"

and if I click on the link, to get an explanation:

"Video ist in meinem Land nicht verfügbar

Einige YouTube-Content-Partner veröffentlichen ihre Videos nur in bestimmten Ländern. Dies liegt unter anderem daran, dass ihre Lizenzrechte nur für eine bestimmte Region gelten. Gelegentlich blockiert YouTube bestimmte Inhalte, um die Einhaltung regionaler Gesetze in den Ländern zu gewährleisten, in denen YouTube verfügbar ist. Zum Beispiel sind Nazi-Bilder in Teilen von Europa verboten."

So first it talks about licenses. Than it talks about laws in certain regions.
The last phrase says that in some parts of Europe Nazi pictures are prohibited.

Why do you think the flytrap-vid is blocked in Germany?
Back to top Go down
Cold Weasel

avatar

Gender : Male Aquarius Posts : 256
Join date : 2012-05-25
Age : 32
Location : East via West

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Thu Dec 20, 2012 9:08 pm

Are other videos from the same user blocked to you?
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Guest
Guest



PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Thu Dec 20, 2012 9:50 pm

Yes, the whole channel is blocked.

"Dieser Kanal ist in deinem Land nicht verfügbar."

->This channel is not available in your country.
Back to top Go down
Cold Weasel

avatar

Gender : Male Aquarius Posts : 256
Join date : 2012-05-25
Age : 32
Location : East via West

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Thu Dec 20, 2012 10:43 pm

There are several "right-wing" and Nazi-themed videos on the channel. I'm not sure how exactly the laws work but I guess it's not surprising the channel would be blocked in Germany.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Guest
Guest



PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Fri Dec 21, 2012 4:10 am

Julius Evola - The world's most right-wing thinker, my notes

"Nietzsche = Riding the tiger of modernity", that is a good descripton.

Perennialism seems to be a key in understanding possible peers from other cultural backgrounds, who grew up in another language, Religion ect. (What's the difference to Universalism? Or even Unitarianism? ...)

I find Evola to be too much of an Idealist and very much all over the place culturally. I am closer to the Classicism of Spengler and Nietzsche, favoring the Greek antique, but trying to keep an open mind towards other cultures. What sounds interesting is his radical metaphysical view. I read his book on Alchemy years ago. This is a depth that Nietzsche misses to some regard, being more materialist and Eurocentric in his outlook.

"Everyone in a group is a priest" - Nice observation.

"Artist, Warrior, Believer."

"Evola doesn't believe in progress. Nor does the tradition he comes out of. They don't believe in scientific progress. They don't believe in Evolution." (video 3/7, 04:50) Smile

"He believed that the apes are descended from us, as we go upwards." (video 3/7 05:20)

-> Here in a sense of "vertical tension" probably, like Nietzsches Übermensch. We have to work out, why Nietzsches Übermensch has nothing to do with Progressivism, but high Idealism! The Übermensch is often falsely related still. Even over at counter-currents in regards to a recent movie. (Limitless, 2011). This is in no way Übermensch of any kind. I think in their article they state that too, to be honest. But still the Übermensch meme is often confused with the Superman, who is a modernized version, w/o any of the original meaning, but turned on its head.

Evola was an esoteric (in the best sense of the word) like Plotin. See his metaphysical (neoplatonic) worldview (cosmology): video 5/7 beginning (0:30 min). And video 6/7 (7:30 min).

-Hermeneutics.

"Most right-wing people are pessimistic introverts." True. Evola on the other hand was creative and optimistic.

Genius lecture!
Back to top Go down
Satyr
Daemon
avatar

Gender : Male Pisces Posts : 13743
Join date : 2009-08-24
Age : 51
Location : Flux

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Fri Dec 21, 2012 7:03 pm

Can’t relate to the skepticism concerning evolution.
Evola missed the bus on this one.
No need to be born of gods to become god-like; no need to be born on a peek to climb mountains.
The world might be conceived as being cyclical, but life is not. Life is a portion of the cycle which (re)acts against, opposes, the downward swing.

And Nietzsche was a bit too leftist …or too soft.
His “eternal return” a clever test of one’s self-love.
His Übermensch a hypothetical, future man who has come to terms with his own nature, his own temporality.

This is what the overcoming of resentiment entails.

_________________
γνῶθι σεαυτόν
μηδέν άγαν
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://satyr.canadian-forum.com/
Guest
Guest



PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Fri Dec 21, 2012 8:31 pm

Quote :

Can’t relate to the skepticism concerning evolution.
Evola missed the bus on this one.

I know two people, who were raised strictly catholic. 1.) One of them went through a phase of atheism and later turned to New Age esotericism and other crap. 2.) The other turned to occultism and western esotericism (with kabbalistic influences).

Both of them went the wrong way according to Evola. We should stay within the belief we were raised and just expand our horizons. This is at least how I understand him and what I think.

I was raised atheistic. So that's why I have been interested in Religion very much all of my life. All sorts of Religions. But I know in my heart that I will forever stay an atheist. It's psychological (nurture) programming during childhood.

People do not convert to other Religions/beliefs, they are just capable to learn from other influences.

So the 2 people I mentioned are both confused today. The second one is a struggling catholic, but gets a lot of hubris from his occult knowledge and initiations, why he does not fit in anymore. This might be a good thing, if it were an aristocratic knowledge that he developed. But it's just delusion. And the first one is an off the charts feminized narcissist.

Both could have become like Evola. Intellectuals.

Quote :

No need to be born of gods to become god-like; no need to be born on a peek to climb mountains.

Evola is pragmatic in this sense. He stayed a catholic. And used this worldview to expand his knowledge. It didn't fit together with Evolutiontheory. Who cares. What does it matter really? Who cares for "scientific truth" about the origins of man, when the survival of mankind is at stake?

Quote :

His Übermensch a hypothetical, future man who has come to terms with his own nature, his own temporality.

This is what the overcoming of resentiment entails.

It entails more than that! Much more, that's why today I'd favor Evola over Nietzsche. I cannot even read Nietzsche anymore. He is too materialist for me. I was raised an atheist and I know firsthand that just believing in the own temporality isn't all there is to overcome resentment. See the whole leftist history for proof of that. The worst Nihilists are leftist atheists.
Back to top Go down
apaosha
Daeva
avatar

Gender : Male Virgo Posts : 1495
Join date : 2009-08-24
Age : 30
Location : Ireland

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Fri Dec 21, 2012 8:57 pm

Satyr wrote:
And Nietzsche was a bit too leftist …or too soft.

How is Nietzsche "leftist"? How does he even fit in the left-right spectrum?

_________________
"I do not exhort you to work but to battle; I do not exhort you to peace but to victory. May your work be a battle; may your peace be a victory." -TSZ
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://knowthyself.forumotion.net
Satyr
Daemon
avatar

Gender : Male Pisces Posts : 13743
Join date : 2009-08-24
Age : 51
Location : Flux

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Fri Dec 21, 2012 9:05 pm

apaosha wrote:
Satyr wrote:
And Nietzsche was a bit too leftist …or too soft.

How is Nietzsche "leftist"? How does he even fit in the left-right spectrum?
He didn’t go far enough into the racial differences.

He flattered Jesus and Socrates.

_________________
γνῶθι σεαυτόν
μηδέν άγαν
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://satyr.canadian-forum.com/
Satyr
Daemon
avatar

Gender : Male Pisces Posts : 13743
Join date : 2009-08-24
Age : 51
Location : Flux

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Fri Dec 21, 2012 9:17 pm

Laconian wrote:
I was raised atheistic. So that's why I have been interested in Religion very much all of my life. All sorts of Religions. But I know in my heart that I will forever stay an atheist. It's psychological (nurture) programming during childhood.
I was raised by a theistic, pragmatic, mother, an an emotional, communist, atheist father.

Laconian wrote:
People do not convert to other Religions/beliefs, they are just capable to learn from other influences.
What I am instructed by is my percpetinos of the world, constantly tested, and doubted.
I will not flatter myself to achieve a goal.

Laconian wrote:
So the 2 people I mentioned are both confused today. The second one is a struggling catholic, but gets a lot of hubris from his occult knowledge and initiations, why he does not fit in anymore. This might be a good thing, if it were an aristocratic knowledge that he developed. But it's just delusion. And the first one is an off the charts feminized narcissist.
This is why intelligence is but a prerequisite, to awareness.

Laconian wrote:
Evola is pragmatic in this sense. He stayed a catholic. And used this worldview to expand his knowledge. It didn't fit together with Evolutiontheory. Who cares. What does it matter really? Who cares for "scientific truth" about the origins of man, when the survival of mankind is at stake?
I do not give a shit about "mankind" or its communal salvation.
I seek a sense of reality, not to dominate the herd and be a ram to the sheeple.

If, like Plato, one discovers that the "truth" is not condusive to cooperative unions, then he invents a Socrates, a precursor to Jesus, to guide the herd.
What Plato realized is personified in his Socratic figure.
Someone who dies to make a point to imbeciles....so as to help them.

Laconian wrote:
It entails more than that!
Much more, that's why today I'd favor Evola over Nietzsche. I cannot even read Nietzsche anymore. He is too materialist for me. I was raised an atheist and I know firsthand that just believing in the own temporality isn't all there is to overcome resentment. See the whole leftist history for proof of that. The worst Nihilists are leftist atheists.
If "resentiment" was so easily overcome then the overman would be a man of the present not the "future man".

Telling a lie to a moron to make him do something you want him to do is not the same as convincing yourself that the lie is a fact to improve your performance.
I would rather do wihtout or die than compromise my own mind so as to achive the goal of survival.
I would rather die a man than suck cock to live.

You dream of world conquest, my friend, perhaps infected with this desire to find somethnig deeper than the ahteism you were raised on.
This si where I am Traditionalism part ways.
I will not bend over to some God-King, nor palce Him above myself in any way.

_________________
γνῶθι σεαυτόν
μηδέν άγαν
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://satyr.canadian-forum.com/
Guest
Guest



PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Fri Dec 21, 2012 9:30 pm

apaosha wrote:
Satyr wrote:
And Nietzsche was a bit too leftist …or too soft.

How is Nietzsche "leftist"? How does he even fit in the left-right spectrum?

Materialism is essentially Leftism.

"Dr. Oldmeadow speaks on "Tradition Betrayed: The False Prophets of Modernism" at the Sacred Web Conference on "Tradition in the Modern World" held in Edmonton at The University of Alberta, September 2006. He gives a thorough definition of the term "modernism" as used by Tradionalists/Perennialists, and refutes several key modern ideologies opposed to Tradition, those of Darwin, Marx, Freud, and Nietzsche. Oldmeadow also explains these "pseudo-mythologies" in opposition to the "sense of the sacred.""

Back to top Go down
apaosha
Daeva
avatar

Gender : Male Virgo Posts : 1495
Join date : 2009-08-24
Age : 30
Location : Ireland

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Fri Dec 21, 2012 9:41 pm

Satyr wrote:
apaosha wrote:
Satyr wrote:
And Nietzsche was a bit too leftist …or too soft.

How is Nietzsche "leftist"? How does he even fit in the left-right spectrum?
He didn’t go far enough into the racial differences.

He flattered Jesus and Socrates.

How is that "leftist"?

Atheism isn't leftist. The Left's god is the State. Atheism to the Left is simply the manner in which superstition is removed in order that the divine can be brought down to Earth and re-anointed as the tangible.... even though it is as equally unattainable and unreal.

_________________
"I do not exhort you to work but to battle; I do not exhort you to peace but to victory. May your work be a battle; may your peace be a victory." -TSZ


Last edited by apaosha on Fri Dec 21, 2012 9:59 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://knowthyself.forumotion.net
Satyr
Daemon
avatar

Gender : Male Pisces Posts : 13743
Join date : 2009-08-24
Age : 51
Location : Flux

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Fri Dec 21, 2012 9:50 pm

It's modern in the sense that it wants to excuse and to forgive and to unite.
Socrates died to make a point to morons, Jesus to save the vulgar.

The anti-evolution, the perspective that genius emerges spontaneously and mysteriously, as if inheritance has no part in it.

_________________
γνῶθι σεαυτόν
μηδέν άγαν
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://satyr.canadian-forum.com/
apaosha
Daeva
avatar

Gender : Male Virgo Posts : 1495
Join date : 2009-08-24
Age : 30
Location : Ireland

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Fri Dec 21, 2012 10:40 pm

Satyr wrote:
It's modern in the sense that it wants to excuse and to forgive and to unite.

But what does Nietzsche want to excuse or to forgive and who does he want to unite?

Humanity must be overcome. Not all are worthy of this.
No excuses; no forgiveness; no unity, in the sense of all-inclusion.

Quote :
The anti-evolution, the perspective that genius emerges spontaneously and mysteriously, as if inheritance has no part in it.

He described inspiration as he felt it. That it came unsummoned and unlooked for. That he felt like a vessel for another force that used him as it's instrument.

I do not think that that is meant to be taken literally.

_________________
"I do not exhort you to work but to battle; I do not exhort you to peace but to victory. May your work be a battle; may your peace be a victory." -TSZ
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://knowthyself.forumotion.net
Satyr
Daemon
avatar

Gender : Male Pisces Posts : 13743
Join date : 2009-08-24
Age : 51
Location : Flux

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Fri Dec 21, 2012 10:44 pm

He pulled his punches too much; masked himself in prose.

His rejection of Evolution Theory is problematic for me.
I am willing to go for mysticism as a way of dealing with the unknowable and as a way of paying homage to all that brings life about but not to hide from the obvious.
This idea that genius is random...that it just happens is ridiculous.
An equalization under the pretext of luck.

_________________
γνῶθι σεαυτόν
μηδέν άγαν
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://satyr.canadian-forum.com/
Guest
Guest



PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Sat Dec 22, 2012 6:30 am

We are both reactionary. You react to the blind judeo-christian faith of North Americans. And I react to the secular humanism of Northern Europeans.

Satyr wrote:

I was raised by a theistic, pragmatic, mother, an an emotional, communist, atheist father.

Funny. I could say the same for me, to be more precise. Aren't all women theists!?

Quote :

What I am instructed by is my percpetinos of the world, constantly tested, and doubted.
I will not flatter myself to achieve a goal.

And if the goal is mere survival?

Quote :

This is why intelligence is but a prerequisite, to awareness.

And highly overrated, since there are more female forms of awareness that can do without much intelligence.

Quote :

I do not give a shit about "mankind" [...]

But your very own survival may depend on it! The levelling of mankind actually leads to its dying out. (According to Evola and I agree.) So, I'm not talking about altruism or humanism here. It's an aristocratic way of thinking.

Quote :

[...]or its communal salvation.

Even Nietzsches Overman may have been an utopia. And Spenglers "Imperium" (Empire), also.

Quote :

I seek a sense of reality, not to dominate the herd and be a ram to the sheeple.

Isn't being unaffected also a form of "domination"? (Not being influenced)

Quote :

What Plato realized is personified in his Socratic figure.
Someone who dies to make a point to imbeciles....so as to help them.

That was just the Plato for the masses, nevertheless the Neoplatonists (Plotin) found some more and in my opinion still valuable essence in Plato himself. Plato the Philosopher King.

Quote :

If "resentiment" was so easily overcome then the overman would be a man of the present not the "future man".

----Not caring about what Nietzsche intended the term "overman" to mean for a moment: Why place the "Overman" in the future and not in the past? Weren't the high pagan cultures overmen? May not Nietzsches placing of the overman in the future been misleading and part of his nihilism.

Quote :

Telling a lie to a moron to make him do something you want him to do is not the same as convincing yourself that the lie is a fact to improve your performance.

You are very reactionary to your judeo-christian surrounding. As I would probably too. But the herd here is atheistic. It's not convincing yourself that a lie is fact. It's about a common Utopia. But not for the masses, but for an elite. And since this "utopia" is the only way of survival... the term is not even correct.

Quote :

I would rather do wihtout or die than compromise my own mind so as to achive the goal of survival.

Evola was catholic, but in a highly educated sense. No blind believing moron.

Quote :

I would rather die a man than suck cock to live.

Traditionalism is not about sucking cock. It's paying homage to ones ancestors and their metaphysical beliefs and goals and thereby raising ones own view above modern materialism.

Quote :

You dream of world conquest, my friend, [...]

This is a necessary view (for survival). If I don't do it, others will. And they'll develop enough spirit to come and take my land. As they're doing already. (See: Samuel Huntington "The Clash of Civilizations".)

Quote :

[...]perhaps infected with this desire to find somethnig deeper than the ahteism you were raised on.

My parents were humiliated and degraded as all Germans post WWII. It is my ancestors before their generation that had a spirit my heart longs for.

Quote :

This si where I am Traditionalism part ways. I will not bend over to some God-King, nor palce Him above myself in any way.

Neoplatonism is a form of deism, I guess. It helps me to raise my view above the mere materialism/atheism/nihilistic leftism around me. (No intervening god.)

Question: Where does Nietzsche reject Evolution Theory? I am curious, because Evola rejects Evolutions theory and I read an essay where he links Nietzsches overman (maybe falsely interpreted) to a progressivist view and Evolution Theory...
Back to top Go down
Satyr
Daemon
avatar

Gender : Male Pisces Posts : 13743
Join date : 2009-08-24
Age : 51
Location : Flux

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Sat Dec 22, 2012 8:08 am

Laconian wrote:
We are both reactionary. You react to the blind judeo-christian faith of North Americans. And I react to the secular humanism of Northern Europeans.
Secular Humanism - in Canada also - is a continuance of Judeo-Christianity.

Laconian wrote:
Funny. I could say the same for me, to be more precise. Aren't all women theists!?
All women are attracted to a dominant, masculine figure.
God in Judeo-Christianity; the institution, the ideal, in Secular Humanism.

Laconian wrote:
And if the goal is mere survival?
Then an animal is all you are.

Laconian wrote:
And highly overrated, since there are more female forms of awareness that can do without much intelligence.
This is where a masculine mind should take control over all the percpetions: organize them, fit them into a greater picture, stand at a distance and judge it.
If survival is on the mind then you are not detached.

Laconian wrote:
But your very own survival may depend on it! The levelling of mankind actually leads to its dying out. (According to Evola and I agree.)
A hunter depends on his prey and takes care to protect it from too much predation, but he does not define himself by it and if the prey dies out he seeks another.

We must define what we mean by "mankind", or "humanity."
I do not consider the scientific designations of species to be enough. Geens are a foundation upon which I define human by memetic attributes.

Laconian wrote:
Even Nietzsches Overman may have been an utopia. And Spenglers "Imperium" (Empire), also.
It was a projected Ideal.

Ideals should act like lighthouses on the distant shore. They help us orient ourselves in the churning sea, but we can never get to them.

Laconian wrote:
Isn't being unaffected also a form of "domination"? (Not being influenced)
Yes, indifference is a symptom of indepedence.

Laconian wrote:
That was just the Plato for the masses, nevertheless the Neoplatonists (Plotin) found some more and in my opinion still valuable essence in Plato himself. Plato the Philosopher King.
Perhaps Plato's Philosopher King was a description of an ideal man who had to sell lies to those he was forced to depend upon but felt no sympathy for.
Read Lampert's "How Philosophy Became Socratic."

Laconian wrote:
---Not caring about what Nietzsche intended the term "overman" to mean for a moment: Why place the "Overman" in the future and not in the past? Weren't the high pagan cultures overmen? May not Nietzsches placing of the overman in the future been misleading and part of his nihilism.
I would think that in relation to you the ideal is always projected into the future...it is the yet to be, the desired.

Perhaps Jesus and Socrates were overmen.
But simply being one does not make you an ideal because each has his own motive.
One way of overcoming one's mortality, one's temporal nature, is to place identity outside the corporeal...the flesh and bones material, shell.
It is what many ideologies and spiritual teachings do.

This is how suffering and death can be endured and soemtimes even welcomed.

Laconian wrote:
You are very reactionary to your judeo-christian surrounding. As I would probably too. But the herd here is atheistic.
I live in Canada, and Canada is like Europe in many ways.

Laconian wrote:
It's not convincing yourself that a lie is fact. It's about a common Utopia. But not for the masses, but for an elite. And since this "utopia" is the only way of survival... the term is not even correct.
For me becoming as aware of the world as it is trumps survival.
If it did not I would settle for the most comforting perspective and never try to go beyond it.

Reality cannot be endured by all.
This is why a lie must be perpetuated to keep the herd happy and productive and, most of all, disciplined.
Plato realized this when his teachings were producing monsters.
This is why he admired Sparta.

Laconian wrote:
Evola was catholic, but in a highly educated sense. No blind believing moron.
Anyone who believes in a Christian God does so blindly.

Laconian wrote:
Traditionalism is not about sucking cock. It's paying homage to ones ancestors and their metaphysical beliefs and goals and thereby raising ones own view above modern materialism.
Then no God is required.

Matter is a form of energy...a less active form.
If it is defiend as static, substance, then it is another mistake.

What is more hard, more material, is what in relation to the observer is less active....less in Flux.
Matter is a degree of activity.

Laconian wrote:
This is a necessary view (for survival). If I don't do it, others will. And they'll develop enough spirit to come and take my land. As they're doing already. (See: Samuel Huntington "The Clash of Civilizations".)
Huntington's broad categories did not inlcude internal fragementations.
For him Judaism was part of European Civilization.
For me Hindus and the Midieval Japanese were more closer to the European spirit.

Laconian wrote:
Neoplatonism is a form of deism, I guess. It helps me to raise my view above the mere materialism/atheism/nihilistic leftism around me. (No intervening god.)
Then you do not need a God.
You worship nature.

Laconian wrote:
Question: Where does Nietzsche reject Evolution Theory? I am curious, because Evola rejects Evolutions theory and I read an essay where he links Nietzsches overman (maybe falsely interpreted) to a progressivist view and Evolution Theory...
You know, I can't remember where, but I think Nieatszche did not buy inot Darwinism.
He was, at least, sketical about it.
Maybe someone else can clarify.

I just recall being a bit surprised by it, after his other profound insights.

_________________
γνῶθι σεαυτόν
μηδέν άγαν
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://satyr.canadian-forum.com/
Guest
Guest



PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Sat Dec 22, 2012 9:18 am

Satyr wrote:

Secular Humanism - in Canada also - is a continuance of Judeo-Christianity.

Yes it is, but there are also distinct differences! I favor Christianity over secular humanism, for it still has spirit.

Quote :

Then an animal is all you are.

I tend to believe in Darwinism. I see myself as an animal, but not in a derogatory sense. I believe survival is programmed within all of us. To what degree it occupies the mind depends on outer circumstances (war or safety) and how much fear one has. I am not completely fearless. I would never claim that. So yes, sometimes fear occupies my mind.

Quote :

If survival is on the mind then you are not detached.

I don't claim to be completely detached.

Quote :

A hunter depends on his prey and takes care to protect it from too much predation, but he does not define himself by it and if the prey dies out he seeks another.

I don't see myself in this analogy at all. I am no hunter. And I am no ones prey either. There is a clash of civilizations going on in my country. And a memetic war also, for an even longer time already.

Quote :

We must define what we mean by "mankind", or "humanity."
I do not consider the scientific designations of species to be enough. Geens are a foundation upon which I define human by memetic attributes.

I do mean Homo Sapiens.

Quote :

I would think that in relation to you the ideal is always projected into the future...it is the yet to be, the desired.

Correct, but Nietzsche was anti-traditionalist. He was modernist. He was utopian/futurist. He had the right ideas, but he lead people astray by not emphasizing the direction of his thoughts (back in time). So he was a nihilist futurist, like all modern leftist utopian thinkers.

Quote :

Perhaps Jesus and Socrates were overmen.

Jesus was more of a Superman. That is the judeo-christian version of the overman. A perversion of Nietzsches original idea.

Quote :

One way of overcoming one's mortality, one's temporal nature, is to place identity outside the corporeal...the flesh and bones material, shell.
It is what many ideologies and spiritual teachings do.

Like Neoplatonism.

Quote :

This is how suffering and death can be endured and soemtimes even welcomed.

I admire the Hagakure and the Spartans.

Quote :

I live in Canada, and Canada is like Europe in many ways.

I lived in North America for a year and have been traveling there often. I see a distinct difference between Northern Europe and North America. In that North America is wayyyyy more Christian. There is some charismatic Christianity going on. Very actively. We have none of that over here. All the church related stuff here is really lame and financed barely by public taxes. I kind of enjoyed some of the more lively Christianity in the US even.

Quote :

For me becoming as aware of the world as it is trumps survival.

We all have a survival instinct. You may be more fearless than most.

Quote :

If it did not I would settle for the most comforting perspective and never try to go beyond it.

You are too hard on yourself in a restrictive sense. Neoplatonism (deism) is comforting, but it also enables you to focus your minds energies elsewhere than battling theists.

Quote :

Reality cannot be endured by all.
This is why a lie must be perpetuated to keep the herd happy and productive and, most of all, disciplined.
Plato realized this when his teachings were producing monsters.
This is why he admired Sparta.

Sounds interesting. With the "monsters". I haven't studied Plato yet.

Quote :

Anyone who believes in a Christian God does so blindly.

So Evola allowed himself this blindness. This weakness. But this way he was able to focus his masculinity on politics and many intellectual, spiritual and esoteric endeavours.

Quote :

Then no God is required.

That's where I personally part with the Traditionalists also, as having been raised atheist. But I tolerate their belief in a god. It is their upbringing, that led them there. And I share a lot of their perspectives.

Quote :

Matter is a form of energy...a less active form.
If it is defiend as static, substance, then it is another mistake.

What is more hard, more material, is what in relation to the observer is less active....less in Flux.
Matter is a degree of activity.

Nietzsche and all Leftists bore me. They seem static to me. Inactive. Right-wing thinkers get my mind running. Even if it is my opposition to them, that I am trying to work out, that keeps my mind running.

Quote :

Huntington's broad categories did not inlcude internal fragementations.
For him Judaism was part of European Civilization.
For me Hindus and the Midieval Japanese were more closer to the European spirit.

Yes. I am talking Islamization of Europe to be exact.

Quote :

Then you do not need a God.
You worship nature.

Plotins Neoplatonism does worship nature. "God" is the absent, the undefined. The cosmological order.

Quote :

You know, I can't remember where, but I think Nieatszche did not buy inot Darwinism.
He was, at least, sketical about it.
Maybe someone else can clarify.

I just recall being a bit surprised by it, after his other profound insights.

Doesn't matter so much. Nietzsche is necessary for people in their early until mid twenties. After that some more profound esoteric and political thinkers like Evola, Spengler, and others should take over, who advanced his work.
Back to top Go down
Cold Weasel

avatar

Gender : Male Aquarius Posts : 256
Join date : 2012-05-25
Age : 32
Location : East via West

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Mon Dec 24, 2012 3:33 am

Laconian wrote:
I lived in North America for a year and have been traveling there often. I see a distinct difference between Northern Europe and North America. In that North America is wayyyyy more Christian. There is some charismatic Christianity going on. Very actively. We have none of that over here. All the church related stuff here is really lame and financed barely by public taxes. I kind of enjoyed some of the more lively Christianity in the US even.

This makes me smile. Did you go to a particular Church? Where?

I was raised in the "Bible Belt." My mother was raised in the Church of Christ (a "non-denominational" church) and my father was raised Baptist. Not especially "lively" sects. Also pretty mainstream and with classical liberal values....usually a strong regional pride...susceptible to neo-conservatism and "patriotism." Not overly emotional or irrational in day-to-day life--working class, and rural, practical, "common sense"-oriented. More masculine and traditional in this sense. Morally opposed to leftists and distrustful of academics and intellectuals--but if you give leftist ideas a Christian package you can easily manipulate them (which is what the Zionists do). Usually don't drink or smoke, and feel uncomfortable around people who drink, smoke, or curse a lot. I'm sure my upbringing in this culture will always mark me.

One time I went to a Pentecostal revival with a friend's family when I was 12. The sanctuary was enormous, there was a huge choir, the music was loud and joyous, and very emotional. Fast-paced gospel music...African- and rock-influenced...I'm sure you've heard the kind.

I got frightened because grown men started running, jumping over seats, crying, and yelling gibberish ("speaking in tongues"). Everyone holding their hands up, "feeling the Spirit," etc. My anxiety built up until I just had to let go and accept what was happening...and finally I could see that everyone was happy, so I reasoned it was OK to be part of it. Then I cried too. There's nothing like it. I have never been in a room in which so many hundreds of people were so utterly ecstatic. But I didn't want to go back. The concept of going to Church in your nicest clothes, in order to completely chimp out and roll around on the floor, just didn't make sense.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Guest
Guest



PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Mon Dec 24, 2012 6:11 am

I was young and easily impressed. I met my first magician. A charismatic preacher. He opened my chakras. So he made me fall over and someone, who was standing behind me caught me. But I didn't cry or let them convert me to their pocket-version of Jesus.

I don't claim things haven't changed since then in the US too and become more secular. In my discussion with Satyr above, I just wanted to point out that I don't see a reason to be so orthodox in my atheism (in fact I do see a lot of value in the "deistic worldview" of Neoplatonism). But I generally agree, that it would be hard to find peers amongst theists, even the traditonalist kind over at counter-currents. Evola lived at a slightly other time. Maybe if he was alive today, he'd be an atheist also. I just hate it when people of the New Right today brush over these distinct differences towards mainstream modernity lightly and make Evola and Spengler their masters, without having read them. (I'm talking counter-currents here, not Satyr.)

I kissed the ground, after my year in the US was over. The americans are honest and heartfelt people (even the theists,I guess). Maybe because they have no culture, it is also that they are less arrogant, than Europeans. And I enjoyed their nationalism. They seem to be more psychologically aware. They notice one another more. But that too maybe related to the size of town/city. It was small in the US and is quite big here.
Back to top Go down
Lyssa
Har Har Harr
avatar

Gender : Female Posts : 9035
Join date : 2012-03-01
Location : The Cockpit

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Mon Dec 24, 2012 5:57 pm

Not sure, but I think Troy Southgate is planning to release a book on the complete thoughts of Bowden - Arktos publications.


_________________
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://ow.ly/RLQvm
apaosha
Daeva
avatar

Gender : Male Virgo Posts : 1495
Join date : 2009-08-24
Age : 30
Location : Ireland

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Tue Jan 08, 2013 6:42 am

Bowden's last interview before he died, part 1:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

_________________
"I do not exhort you to work but to battle; I do not exhort you to peace but to victory. May your work be a battle; may your peace be a victory." -TSZ
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://knowthyself.forumotion.net
Lyssa
Har Har Harr
avatar

Gender : Female Posts : 9035
Join date : 2012-03-01
Location : The Cockpit

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Wed Jan 09, 2013 2:05 pm

Bowden: The Uses and Abuses of Nietzsche.


_________________
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*


Last edited by Lyssa on Fri Jun 10, 2016 6:08 am; edited 1 time in total
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://ow.ly/RLQvm
Lyssa
Har Har Harr
avatar

Gender : Female Posts : 9035
Join date : 2012-03-01
Location : The Cockpit

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Tue Jan 29, 2013 6:59 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

_________________
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://ow.ly/RLQvm
Cold Weasel

avatar

Gender : Male Aquarius Posts : 256
Join date : 2012-05-25
Age : 32
Location : East via West

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Fri Feb 15, 2013 9:32 am

apaosha wrote:
Interesting. Great symbolism.

For example?
Back to top Go down
View user profile
apaosha
Daeva
avatar

Gender : Male Virgo Posts : 1495
Join date : 2009-08-24
Age : 30
Location : Ireland

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Fri Feb 15, 2013 11:52 am

I don't have time to watch it again. From what I can remember.... Bowden's predatory demeanour. The women are prizes to be won, or seduced.

_________________
"I do not exhort you to work but to battle; I do not exhort you to peace but to victory. May your work be a battle; may your peace be a victory." -TSZ
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://knowthyself.forumotion.net
Lyssa
Har Har Harr
avatar

Gender : Female Posts : 9035
Join date : 2012-03-01
Location : The Cockpit

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Fri Jun 10, 2016 6:07 am


_________________
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://ow.ly/RLQvm
Lyssa
Har Har Harr
avatar

Gender : Female Posts : 9035
Join date : 2012-03-01
Location : The Cockpit

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Fri Jun 10, 2016 6:12 am


_________________
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://ow.ly/RLQvm
Lyssa
Har Har Harr
avatar

Gender : Female Posts : 9035
Join date : 2012-03-01
Location : The Cockpit

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Mon Jun 20, 2016 1:09 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

_________________
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://ow.ly/RLQvm
Cold Weasel

avatar

Gender : Male Aquarius Posts : 256
Join date : 2012-05-25
Age : 32
Location : East via West

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Mon Jun 20, 2016 4:47 pm

That's a great read. It puts the Frankfurt School into a balanced perspective and reminds me why as a university student I was drawn to Critical Theory as a way to try to articulate my angst.
Back to top Go down
View user profile
Slaughtz



Gender : Male Pisces Posts : 979
Join date : 2012-04-28
Age : 26
Location : Brink

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Mon Jun 20, 2016 8:33 pm

Back to top Go down
View user profile
Lyssa
Har Har Harr
avatar

Gender : Female Posts : 9035
Join date : 2012-03-01
Location : The Cockpit

PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden Sun Nov 13, 2016 6:22 pm

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

_________________
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
Back to top Go down
View user profile http://ow.ly/RLQvm
Sponsored content




PostSubject: Re: Jonathan Bowden

Back to top Go down
 
Jonathan Bowden
View previous topic View next topic Back to top 
Page 1 of 1
 Similar topics
-
» Jonathan Bowden
» The Storytelling Animal - How Stories Make Us Human by Jonathan Gottschall
» dr Blair Bowden costs
» Dead Men's Secrets by Jonathan Gray
» 'The Nine Harbingers Have Been Fulfilled' A Great Shaking Is Coming To America - An Ominous Message From Jonathan Cahn

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
Know Thyself :: AGORA :: LYCEUM-
Jump to: