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Anfang

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PostSubject: Economists and their views Wed Feb 20, 2013 4:07 pm

Milton Friedman

jewish, libertarian, economist,
alive from 1912 to 2006

influenced by Adam Smith, F. Hayek
influenced Margaret Thatcher

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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Thu Feb 21, 2013 4:35 am

Paul Krugman

jewish, new keynesian economics, feel-good salesman,

Born 1953, a different growing up back then,
he's a delicate flower with a lot of influence and power today,
flower-power economics,

Won the Nobel Prize in economics in 2008... so he's the kind of thinking which is in charge right now.


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I disagree with the other chap, we don't need Orson Wells, we need George Orwell and a perpetual war.

See, GDP was rising during WW2, it was really high, investors could make a lot of money in those times (if you invest in the right stuff), so clearly, it must be a good thing that there was WW2. Made the average american richer, right? Or the average european for that matter.

Because, what we need is work, we are happy when we work and if there is no war to force us to work for a roof over our heads and to put some food on the table then we are fucked.
Then we have to find new things to occupy our minds with and remain docile.
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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Fri Feb 22, 2013 6:03 am

Friedrich Hayek

classical-liberalism as a starting point, interestingly enough was often in agreement with Keynes but more on that curious thing in the link

alive from 1899-1992

influenced by Mises
influenced Thatcher, Reagan, Rothbard

One of his books, (wikipedia):

The Road to Serfdom is a book written by the Austrian-born economist and philosopher Friedrich von Hayek (1899–1992) between 1940–1943, in which he "warned of the danger of tyranny that inevitably results from government control of economic decision-making through central planning," and in which he argues that the abandonment of individualism and classical liberalism inevitably leads to a loss of freedom, the creation of an oppressive society, the tyranny of a dictator and the serfdom of the individual. Significantly, Hayek challenged the general view among British academics that fascism was a capitalist reaction against socialism, instead arguing that fascism and socialism had common roots in central economic planning and the power of the state over the individual.

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Lyssa
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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Fri Feb 22, 2013 7:34 pm

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

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Anfang

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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Mon Feb 25, 2013 2:53 pm

Thank you, I was looking for someone who wrote about the combination of social and economic dynamics. I don't think the Austrian school is wrong when it comes to producing goods for consumption and how to do that with maximum efficiency - (the goal/foundation/reasoning why they advocate personal liberty) - but that's not everything there can be in life.


Last edited by Anfang on Mon Feb 25, 2013 4:02 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Mon Feb 25, 2013 3:49 pm

I don't approve of Veblen; I present him here as a hostile-source to learn from.

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Mon Feb 25, 2013 4:01 pm

Great, now I am biased when I read him. Now I have to endorse him... haha

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Lyssa
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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Mon Feb 25, 2013 5:08 pm

That's the spirit! ; )

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Mon Feb 25, 2013 5:08 pm

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Mon Feb 25, 2013 6:31 pm

Nice article by Jack Donovan, he gave me a little insight into Veblen as well. It seems he was a man who didn't feel comfortable with the masculine aspects of himself. And so about masculine qualities in a society.

Hm, it comes down to the masculine/feminine dynamic again.
Tyranny of the masses.
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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Tue Feb 26, 2013 7:57 am

Thomas Aquinas
1225-1274
Dominican priest,...


Some quotes:

To bear with patience wrongs done to oneself is a mark of perfection, but to bear with patience wrongs done to someone else is a mark of imperfection and even of actual sin.

Man should not consider his material possession his own, but as common to all, so as to share them without hesitation when others are in need.

To live well is to work well, to show a good activity.

Sorrow can be alleviated by good sleep, a bath and a glass of wine.



Materialism, hedonism and spiritual ownership of man by god. Masculinity being monopolized. The advancement in technology enabled flatter and flatter hierarchies. The end of aristocracy and the beginning of the 'dictatorship of the people'.
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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Fri Mar 01, 2013 6:35 pm

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Wed May 15, 2013 11:58 am

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Thu Jun 20, 2013 2:05 pm

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Sun Jun 23, 2013 10:01 am

Yes, Hayek is not a man of the physical or the unconscious - that makes him feel uncomfortable, or so he thinks.
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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Tue Sep 10, 2013 5:52 am

Richard Duncan:

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He really transcends Keynesian and Austrian economics. The US has a credit based growth economy and China has a export based growth economy. Once America's credit starts to contract it will trigger a debt-deflation death spiral, GDP will contract by at least 30%, China's economy will implode and global trade will shut down. The two game changers was the breakdown of the Bretton Woods system which aloud massive budget deficits without interest rates going up; and Free Trade laws that exported most manufacturing jobs to low income countries contributing to trade deficits and massive global imbalances.
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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Tue Sep 10, 2013 7:33 am

Then economic collapse is immanent?

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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Tue Sep 10, 2013 9:51 am

We are already on the the way down in most parts of the west. In the USA, in the material sense - old infastructures, less and less manufacturing in the U.S., 'destroyed' farmland which is dependant on artificial fetilizers because it's biologically dead due to unsustainable farming techniques (will take quite some time to reanimate it).

Each global player is trying to maneauver into a position of strength for themselves. To emerge from the upcoming chaos as strong as possible. All have to deal internally with a barn full of hedonistic cows and that will become quite the 'challenge' when there's not enough bread and circus to keep them happy.

I think they'll find a way to postpone it a little further.
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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Tue Sep 10, 2013 10:14 am

Yes. America will default on its debt within 8-10 years, but that's given there's Geo-political stability. At any given moment China could dump a trillion dollars of foreign reserves on American markets triggering hyperinflation. Right now they are slowly building up their gold reserves; in preparation for a dollar collapse.
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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Tue Sep 10, 2013 11:25 am

For the US it all hinges on the reserve currency status of the US Dollar. If they lose that then they will be crushed by the influx of dollars from foreigners who would dump them. In that scenario they would probably default on all their trade deficit obligations and issue a new currency.

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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Wed Sep 11, 2013 8:31 am

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Thu Nov 21, 2013 5:54 pm


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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Thu Nov 21, 2013 5:54 pm

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Sun May 18, 2014 11:01 am

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PostSubject: Re: Economists and their views Wed Apr 01, 2015 1:15 pm

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
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