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PostSubject: Paganism and natural order. Mon Sep 23, 2013 11:44 am

Paganism is being deluted by hippies, commies, theist(christians, jews, muslims), capitalist, and movie industry, and people who see it as a trendy youth movement. So I thought we could do some revisionism, and talk about our views on this topic. Satyr had interesting things to say about the subject in one of his videos, which was actually why I really started to listen, and it really got me thinking.

Here is some of my views I've come to realise by myself, and I would like to get your insight and critique. So basically paganism is primeraly the worship of your ancestors. After a great man died in large family or a tribe, the father, leader, hero or who ever died was honoured by it's tribe for the sacrifice and work he did for the tribe or family. Hero was honored by memory, and the sotries of his deeds were told by singing of songs and tales. If the dead man in question was a great warrior, sailor or hunter, and did amazing things during his life stories were told about him during his life and after his death. This was a way to teach his skillset to rest of the tribe. Tales and stories would be told to teach that knowledge to a new generation. This way great man's deeds, tactics, and insights would not wanish. This way children would learn how to hunt, how to do tactics in battle, or how to sail the seas. Stories, legends and myths were a way to educate children and the next generation, so the next generation would be prepared for life and idenpendence, and thus the bloodline would survive.  

After many generations the stories started to mold, and ancestors became gods. If legend went around a hunter who was able to take down a bear or a wolf, that memory would morph, and sometimes the ancestor would even be a bear, or a wolf. Good sailors would be worshipped as the god of waters and seas. Many of the stories molded ancestors to be gods.  Some heros in ancient myths and tales got animal charectaristics, abilities and sometimes ancestors were the animals or would turn into animal by a curse. This is also how some animals are still being viewed with human charectaristics, just as owl is a wise, fox is sneaky and cunning, etc. Tales were also to teach heroic charectaristics to children. Thus paganism developed from ancestral of bloodlines and heros, to worshipping over all nature, and human identity or charectaristics(depending of your gender), which was seen evolutionary to be advantageous.

The worship of father, ancestors and heros came first. Then came natural enviroment, which provides you food especially hunting and fishing. I am not sure when the seasonal gods, and weather wielding(lightning, rain, sun) gods came to be worhsipped. Maybe those did not come directly from ancestral beliefs, but from the need to find explenation to why nature and weather was changing. I do think that many of the pagan ideas of gods morphed around seasons when agriculture was developed.

Second wave must have been, when tribes would go to war, and slave and marry women of the losing tribe. Stories would travel this way about other gods, and ancestors, and their deeds. Also I think this was the place how nordic and germanic mythos have very much similarity. I think it's safe to asume that at this point the symbolism came to be dominant.

There was no concept of equality, but the tribe and their social ladder developed around pride. Many of the laws were done around pride, and not around punishment.
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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Mon Sep 23, 2013 12:29 pm

Yes, and by worshiping your ancestors you worship your past.
Another way of describing this past, or the sum of all nurturing, is NATURE.

If you think about it, then entropy means increasing randomness, chaos, and it follows that the past is a state if less randomness, or what we call ORDER.
GOD, in the absolute sense, is a projection of the Big Bang completed, finalized, imploding into a singularity: the absolute Black Hole where all possibilities (space) are encompassed by a singular point, with no dimensions and so activity.
We also say that the past determined the present, causation, making the God projection another way of saying the absolute cause.
This is the Male Nihilistic tendency, which is in opposition to the feminine nihilism, we are currently in the process of - the towards absolute randomness, the limitation of all probabilities in a uniform, or absolute state where everything is possible (infinite space).
The Buddhists all this emptiness, because matter/energy is the interpretation of patterned (inter)activity.
Life is a patterned behavior.
Patterns is another way of saying order: consistency, predictability, reliability, stringency, repetitiveness, harmony, symmetry (beauty), intelligence, knowledge/experience, because both are the ordering of sensual data, as genes are an ordered state of bio-data.
Consciousness is this ongoing process of ordering incoming sensual stimulation: interpreting them by simplifying and generalizing and then integrating them into mental models: things, abstractions, rules, laws etc.

But the absolute is what is non-existing, so no God. The projection is a method of directing the Will.

The Hellenes had the ideal of balance, meaning Apollo in control over Dionysian processes.
The ordering, mind, reason, not denying instinct, nature, (Judeo-Christian asceticism) but trying to control it and direct it (Hellenic askisis, asceticism/athleticism).
The feminine dominated by the masculine in the psyche of each individual: THIS is MASCULINITY!
Not hatred or denial of the feminine, but its dominance, its control.

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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Mon Sep 23, 2013 12:33 pm

Love of self, is essentially the full acceptance of your past.
You honor your ancestors not by neglecting their faults or negative aspects, but by embracing them and trying to correct them in yourself.
Not changing the world to suit your insecurities, but changing yourself in relation to the world, by first knowing and accepting your past:
Know Thyself!!!!

I will struggle to become better but I will not hate myself when I fail, nor will I comfort myself with lies and excuses.
THAT is loving yourself, and the world that makes you possible.

This acceptance of one's own nature, one's own temporality, is what Nietzsche described as the overman, the overcoming of this resentiment inherit in liberalism and Judeo-Christianity and all nihilistic psychologies and world-views.

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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Mon Sep 23, 2013 1:17 pm

Now think of the liberal, Judeo-Christian, progressive positions.

A sense of shame for their past, projected as an accusation upon the other.
A hatred of self, again, transferred to the other.

Who introduced guilt and shame into the human mind in relation to nature and to self.
Ego has become an insult.
Consciousness, one's own thoughts, are now external to one's self.

This is why they always bring out emotion and project it as something coming from the other.
It is their hate and embarrassment, and rejection of self, which is directed towards an otherness. This is the hypocritical part.
When they speak of "freedom" it means a liberation from their nature, their past, the determinism sum of all nurturing, their heritage.  
Look at present day America and how shallow and superficial it is in all areas, but particularly in the arts.
All reduced to market value, the flavor of the month, the fashion which is ending. the moderns love being on that cutting-edge of change, it feels exhilarating to feel so self-absorbed.  
This result in the culture of hedonism, materialism, the ME generation of retards who are dissatisfied because they were sold on high expectations.
A rejection of the past, as insignificant or too restricting.
A denial of self, reducing identity to a shallow construct of the immediate.  

Then they turn to drugs, alcohol, God, anything to numb their sense of dissatisfaction, their inner emptiness, because they have no tradition, no past to draw inspiration and guidance and strength from.
Lost on the churning waves of temporality.

This is where they become the perfect tools of the system, because in their desperation to find substance they grab onto the most familiar ideas, ideals: those furnished by the system, immediately.
Their liberty is really a delusion, because you may be ignorant or forget or deny the past but it cares not about what you do: it determines you, no matter if you are aware or not.

They latch onto the most convenient, the easiest, the most popular, the fashionable, the things their peers are obsessing over, just to belong, to find a place, a purpose, a meaning, a self.  
A community of the lost, a herd of morons, running wherever the whip and the carrot directs them to go.
Like those schools of fish and those flocks of birds, in those vids I posted.
instinctive, reactionary, behavior requiring little thinking ...but only emoting, feeling, sensing, surrendering your will to otherness.

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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Mon Sep 23, 2013 10:43 pm

Satyr wrote: They latch onto the most convenient, the easiest, the most popular, the fashionable, the things their peers are obsessing over, just to belong, to find a place, a purpose, a meaning, a self. A community of the lost, a herd of morons, running wherever the whip and the carrot directs them to go. Like those schools of fish and those flocks of birds, in those vids I posted. instinctive, reactionary, behavior requiring little thinking ...but only emoting, feeling, sensing, surrendering your will to otherness. wrote:


This quote of yours reminds me of high school; everyone was so obsessed with the ghetto, hip-hop bullshit. And most of these clowns were white ( wiggers ). They acted so cheesy and inauthentic. But that was what was popular at the time and they wanted to fit in like the sheep they are. The hip-hop thing is still popular. I see fools jamming out to the most obnoxious, untalented hip-hop trash still - pretending like they are alpha-male primitives that get all the finest bitches. Creativity, talent, and individuality is perishing.
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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Tue Jan 21, 2014 6:56 pm

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Sun Mar 23, 2014 9:40 am

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"Shadows

The modern European is just a shadow of his forebears:
The average Ancient European could run faster than the modern Olympic sprint champions
The average Ancient European could word by word memorize long poems just by hearing them recited one single time
The average Ancient European could throw a spear longer than the modern Olympic champions can throw a javelin

He could move huge stone blocks, weighing up to 1000 tons
He could make magnifying glasses of ice, and used them to make fire in only a few seconds.
More commonly he had magnifying glasses made of the quarts he found in the Alps
He could navigate the seas using Sun stones and star maps stored in his memory only
He commonly had perfect teeth, and even the old only very rarely suffered from dental caries
He would not even hurt the descendants of men whom had helped one of his own ancestors
If he surviving birth and childhood he could expect to grow as old as we do naturally today
He could perform brain surgery (trephination)
...and the patients survived
Some think he even mastered what we today would call sorcery

He was better than we are today, in all ways...

Why?

Because he lived in harmony with Mother Nature, and respected her laws
Because he cultivated the divine in man for hundreds of thousands of years,
by practising what we today call the European Religion (alias European Paganism)
Because he had not yet been dragged down into the mud by Judeo-Christianity, and all its offshots,
and had not yet lived in their spiritual sewer for up to 2000 years
Judeo-Christianity has been a disaster for Europe.

We are because of it soiled in all ways possible, and on the brink of extinction!
Apathy, weakness and cowardice are fruits of this foreign cult, and can only be cured by a return to the European Religion.

Act, be strong and be brave! Let us together return to life and a future for our European children."
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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Tue Apr 15, 2014 10:01 pm

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Tue Apr 15, 2014 10:01 pm

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Tue Apr 15, 2014 10:01 pm

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Fri Apr 18, 2014 5:01 pm

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Sat May 17, 2014 6:04 pm

Alain de Benoist wrote:
"Paganism is not a "return to the past." It does not consist ofwhat could be called "one past versus another," con- trary to what Alain-Gerard Slama wrote so casually. It is not a manifestation of a desire to return to some kind of "lost paradise" (this is rather a Judeo-Christian theme) and even less, contrary to what Catherine Chalier declared so gratuitously, to a "pure origin."

In a time where one never stops talking about "roots" and "collective memory," the condemnation for being overly attached to the past is self-refuting. Every person is "first born," an heir. There is no individual or collective identity that does not take into account one's connection to those who create us, the source from which we emerged. Just as yesterday we had the grotesque spec- tacle of Christian missionaries worshipping their own gris gris while denouncing "pagan idols," it is somewhat comical today to wimess the denunciation of the "past" (European) by those who ceaselessly boast of the Judeo-Christian continuity and are always presenting for our edification the "ever relevant" examples of Abraham, Jacob, Isaac, and other proto-historical Bedouins.

On the one hand we must reach an understanding ofjust what this word "past" means. We refuse to give any credence whatsoever to the Judeo-Christian problematic that posits the past as a definitively passed point on a line that would necessarily conduct humanity from the Garden of Eden to Messianic times. We do not believe this has any historical meaning. For us the past is a dimension, a perspective that is totally relevant to the present. There are no such things- as "past" events until they insert themselves as such in the present. The perspective opened by how we represent these events to ourselves "transforms" our present in exactly the same fashion the meaning we give them by re-presenting them contributes to their own transformation. The "past" necessarily participates then with that characteristic of human consciousness known as temporality, which is neither the "quantity of (measur- able) time," as is commonly assumed today, nor the duration evoked by Bergson, which is the property of non-human nature temporality belongs to man alone. Life as "worry" (Sorge) is extensive of itself as Heidegger put it; therefore, it does not fit into any pre-established temporal framework. Man is nothing but a project. His consciousness itself is a project. To exist is to ex-sistere, to project (to hurl oneself forward). It is this specific mobility of the ex-tensiveness that Heidegger calls the "historizing" (Geschehen) of human existence-a historizing that absolutely marks "the very structure of human life, which, as a transcendent and revelatory reality, makes possible the hinoricity of a world." Man's historicity stems from the fact that he combines "past," "present," and "future" in the immediate present, which thus form three dimensions that mutually enrich and transform each other. From this perspective, the typically Judea-Christian reproach of too great an attachment to the past is entirely devoid of any meaning.

This kind of attachment to the past can only exist in a mono- linear historical perspective, in fact, in a history where what has "passed" cannot exist again. But this is not the perspective we take. We believe in the Eternal Return. In 1797, Holderlin wrote to Hebel, "There is no such thing as annihilation, therefore the youth of the world must be reborn out of our own decay." In fact, it is not a question ofgoing back to the past, but of connecting with it - and also, by that very fact, in a spherical conception of history, to connect to the eternal and cause it to surge back, to have consonance in life, and to disentangle itself from the tyranny of the logos, the terrible tyraMy of the Law, so as to re-establish the school of the mythos and life. In ancient Greece, Jean-Pierre Vernant observes, "the effort to remember the primary purpose of everything is not the construction of the individual past of a man who remembers the construction of his individual time, but conversely what allows him to escape time."

In the same way it is a question of referring to the "memory" of paganism not in a chronological way, so as to return to an "earlier time," but in a mythological way, to seek for that which, through time, surpasses time and still speaks to us today. It is a question of connecting to something that cmmot be surpassed rather than to something that has been "surpassed."
The tenns "beginning" and "end" therefore do not hold the same meaning for us that they do in the Judea-Christian problematic. In the pagan perspective the past is always future.  
Writes Heidegger, "What existed in the beginning, remains always in the future, remains constantly under the control of what is in the future." [On Being a Pagan]

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Sat May 17, 2014 6:29 pm

Alain de Benoist wrote:
"In his Introduction to Metaphysics/ Heidegger specifically exam- ines the question of the "past." A people, he says, can triumph over the "darkening of the world" and its decline only if its sights are permanently set upon its destiny. Now, a people "will be able to gain a destiny from its vocation only when it creates in itselfa resonance, a possibility of resonance for this vocation, and grasps its tradition creatively. In other words, it is necessary "to recapture the beginning of our historical-spiritual existence, in order to transform it into a new beginning."

And Heidegger adds, "But we do not repeat a beginning by reducing it to something past and now known, which need merely be imitat- ed; no, the beginning must be begun again mo1·e originally, with all the strangeness, darkness, insecurity that attend a true begin- ning."8 In fact "the beginning is there. It is not behind us as some- thing that has been there a long time but it stands before us. The beginning has burst into our future. In the distance it pursues its greatness, a grandeur it is imperative we catch up with."
So it is not a return so much as a recourse to paganism. Or, if one prefers, it is not a return to paganism but a return of paganism toward what Heidegger in this page of luminous importance called "another beginning."

If one accepts the greatness of something, says Heidegger, "then in the beginning of that greatness remains something yet greater." Paganism today therefore clearly requires a certain familiarity with ancient Indo-European religions, their history, their theology, their cosmology, their symbolism, their myths, and the mythemes ofwhich they are composed. A scholarly famil- iarity, but also a spiritzllll familiarity; an epistemological familiarity that is also an intuitive familiarity. This is not simply the accumulation of knowledge concerning the beliefs of various European regions from the time predating Christianity (nor is it ignoring what may distinguish them, sometimes profoundly, from each other), but primarily of identifying within these beliefs the projection, the transposition, of a certain number ofvalues which, as heirs to a culture, belong to us and concern us directly. (This consequently leads to the re-interpretation ofthe history of the last two millennia as the story of a fundamental spiritual struggle).

When the undertakings of previous generations come to grief, the natural response is to start over on this side of the bifurcation, to loosen the duration, and expand the space."  This says exactly what is involved here: to start over "on this side of the bifurcation" for another beginning. But no doubt such a scheme will appear blasphemous to the eyes of many. In Hebrew, the word "beginning" also carries the sense of "profanation." To begin something is to compete with God. The truth of this observation is underlined by a passage in Genesis that refers to Enoch, son of Seth as "the first to invoke the name ofYahweh" (4:26),12 which is interpreted inJewish theology as meaning not the beginning of monotheism but the start of paganism ("So one began. This verb means to profane. One began giving to men and statues the name of Saint Blessed Be He and to call gods idols," was the Rachi commnentary on Genesis 4:26).

The Renaissance of the fourteenth and fifteenth centuries was precisely that: a rebirth. "What it involved," as Renan said, "was seeing Antiquity face to face." This rebirth was no journey backward or a simple resurgence of the "past," but on the contrary the point of departure for a new spiritual adventure, a new adventure of the Faustian soul that was now triumphant because it had awakened to itself. Nor is neo-paganism today a regression either. On the contrary it is the deliberate choice of a more authentic, harmonious, and powerful future - a choice that projects into the future, for new creations, the Eternal from which we come." [On Being a Pagan]

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Sat May 17, 2014 6:30 pm

Alain de Benoist wrote:
"As Gilbert Durand notes in his commentary on Spengler, "far from being an apriori form of sensibility on the same plane as space, time is the antimony of space. The true intuition of time is that of a direction, a meaning.") To the contrary, in space nothing is predetermined in advance about the forms that will be created there. Here everything is much more directly dependent upon man. Asserting the primacy of space is, let me repeat, indirectly exalting man's power. Also, behind the opposition of time and space emerges another that is equally fundamental, between the time-eternity over which Yahweh rules and human time, which is a specifically historical time. This opposition is the classic one from Antiquity between intensity and duration. Unable to master time by very reason of his own finite existence, pagan man masters it through the intensity of his actions - and by the resulting "intensity" of the constructions specific to it. This seems to be what Nietzsche was alluding to in a famous passage from The Antichrist in which he recalls what Christianity, the "vampire" of the imperium Romanum, had contributed to the undoing of the Romans' magnificent creation: "the tremendous deed of the Romans in clearing the ground for a great culture which could take its time was undone overnight by Christianity."" The desire for creation flows logically out of this desire for intensity, as do the desire for form and the desire for style. By all evidence, the Bible's choice is duration; furthermore, the intensity of human actions tries, in the strict sense, the "patience" of Yahweh.

We find here the confrontation between a purely linear conception of time and a cyclical or "spherical" conception, which accepts, among other things, the Eternal Return of the Same. There is no possibility of return in Judeo-Christian monotheism: history cannot tum back on itself; it is going somewhere-toward a never seen event which will be its culmination and its end. Or rather, if there is a "return," it is on a whole different level: the end of history will be the equivalent of a return to the state that existed before history, but this "return" will be an absolute return. It will not be one return among others, an eternal dialectical movement of always starting over, but the radical affirmation, the sign of an absolute end of time, the reabsorption of human history called upon to close itself like a parenthetical expression.

On the other hand, there is no spatial or geographical return either. Levinas hit the nail on the head when he wrote: "To the myth of Ulysses returning to Ithaca, we seek to oppose the history of Abraham leaving his native land forever for one still unknown and forbidding his servant from even bringing his son back to this departure point." In the Bible, one must never go back; one must leave. To leave the city-Ur, Pithom, Babylon, which are human undertakings and places of perdition (but also subse- quently places of redemption: it was in the cities that new-born Christianity made its most spectacular progress)-and go toward the Promised Land. "The Jewish destiny," declares Samuel Trigano, "is to always be leaving Ur in Chaldea for Eretz-lsrael.'" In fact the arrival point is all that matters, a point determined (in the same way as the arrival point of history) by the "promise" of the Covenant and not the point of origin. Eretz-Israel is not a point of origin. It is not where the men of the Bible were engendered. Before being conquered, Eretz-Israel was a gift land, attributed and promised by Yahweh.

Pagan man feels the place of his birth through its relation to his ancestral lineage. He has a "mother-country." In biblical monotheism, to the contrary, there is no native land; there is only a final land, the land of destination that does not derive from any founding myth but clearly from a finality. Singularly enough this finality is more temporal than spatial, as its appropriation constitutes a prerequisite for the advent of Messianic Times. The land of Israel was promised twice: first to Moses by Yahweh (Exodus 6: 8, 23:20-33) when it still belonged to the Hittites, Amorites, and Canaanites, then during the time of the prophets. ("I am going to take the Israelites from among all the nations where they have gone. I am going to gather them from all directions and reunite them on their ground. I will make them one nation in the land, in the mountains ofisrael," Ezekiel 37:21-22). It is still promised much in the same way a fiancee was once "promised" to a man. In fact Eretz-Israel constitutes the fiancee, the future wife of the Hebrews. The Bible develops this nuptial symbolism at length. The law of the Sinai constitutes the ketuba, the marriage contract. The people of Israel are not children of a land; they are the sons of Yahweh...

It is not on the land of Israel, by birth and heritage, that this people was formed, but in Egypt and in the desert, through a moral and religious act. Eretz-lsrael is a fiancee, a wife, but she cannot become a mother--one of those earth mothers worshiped by the "idolatrous." It is a land that was made natal only through contractual proxy; it is a "native land that owes nothing to birth."' Hence the entire theology of exile and "return" (in the limits I have indicated), combined with that of silence and the word. It is also found, perhaps further away and repeated, in the Freudian Oedipal theory that views repression of an "unresolved" attachment to the mother as the source of neurosis - just as the prophets made persistent attachment to the earth mother a source of "idolatry."

This comparison can nonetheless be interpreted in different ways.

In Genesis, one of Cain's characteristic features was his desire for boundaries. He wished to materialize his ownership. According to one midrash, if Cain killed Abel, it was because the latter did not want to respect a division of property that the two had agreed upon. Under the terms of this division, Cain had obtained this world and Abel the "future world." But Abel then argued that he had rights over this world too, because, strictly speaking, as the world had only one creator, it could not truly be divided. (In my opinion this makes Cain's wrath quite understandable!) Condemned to exile and having settled in the "land of Nod" (Genesis 4:16), Cain then makes the distinctively "pagan" choice of intensity versus duration, space versus time-eternity. By constructing a city, as we have seen, he was visibly seeking to lay the foundations of a kingdom or an empire - and this is where his "pride" resided. He transformed, as Eisenberg and Abecassis properly put it, "his temporal issue into a spatial one."

The attitude developed by the Bible with respect to "setting down roots" is therefore extremely ambiguous. A sedentary lifestyle, in opposition to a nomadic one, is given a negative value. Eisenberg and Abecassis go so far as to read in it a condemnation of patriotism as a "pagan sentiment based on man's physical relationship to the earth, identical to the filial relationship in which the child is detennined genetically.

"Freedom with respect to sedentary lifestyles is, perhaps, the human form of being in the world," Levinas declares-which is only a half-truth, because "specifically human" freedom vis-a-vis a fixed dwelling cannot be construed as legitimizing the principle of rejecting all fixed dwellings. It is also curious to see how the Succoth feast, originally a typically agrarian feast (see Deuteronomy 16:13-16), subsequently became a nomadic one. Even after the formation of the kingdom of Israel and the settlement upon the Promised Land, the nomadic vocation continued to be embodied by the gerim, whose life is a long pilgrimage (maggour).

The universe is thus conceived in the Bible as a world with no spatial boundaries but limited in time, whereas in paganism it is considered to be limitless in time but a place where man has the duty to draw spatial boundaries. Frontiers established in space establish man as the master of the space he occupies. Boundaries in time, absolute caesuras, only show what distinguishes man from God. In the one case there are established roots and specificity, in the other, the vocation to universalism and deterritorialization. "Settlement within a country, attachment to a place, without which the world would become insignificant and hardly exist," writes Levinas again, "is the very scission of humanity into autochthones and foreigners." In principle, though, this "scission" does not imply either rejection or scorn. Rather it forms the primary condition for the maintenance and respect of collective differences. It is not so certain that the same holds true for the ideal of the abolition of frontiers, which Thorlief Boman regards, according to the Bible, as the normal state if not final destination of the world.

An ideal which is very close, in any case, to the very contemporary apologia of the "man with the soles of the wind," the Deleuzo-Guattarist "rhizome" (as opposed to the "root") and of universal nomadism, in a world where the non-place of the desert's anonymity tends to be replaced by the non-place of the urban environment's anonymity - whereas the "world" cities are no longer the places where history works toward its fulfillment but rather the site of its simulacrum and annihilation.

Andre Chouraqui speaks of a "verbal world." It is the activity (of man) that produces intensity, but it is the word (of Yahweh) that acts upon duration. In the Bible, the word is the decisive reality of the world of lived experience. In the extreme case, the world is commingled with the word that created it; in Hebrew the same word, davar, can mean either object or word. In paganism the decisive reality of the world of lived experience is the result of action.

Goethe's phrase: "In the beginning there was the action," responds to the phrase in the Scriptures: "In the beginning there was the word." In the face of the symphony that reigns in pagan religions, the Bible therefore poses silence as the metaphysical form of the cosmos (Andre Neher), silence where only the logos - the word of Yahweh resonates, although in the final instance, the being of that particular being can only be identical to silence as well.

The Judea-Christian world is a world that has been issued from the word. This is why the name of Yahweh, an unspeakable name, is declared all-powerful (see Psalms 8 ). It is the word that creates the bond between created being and non-created being. One reads in Genesis: "God said, 'Let there be Light"' (1:3). One enters the dynamic phase of the creation through the intermediary of the logos. In the Bible, "to do" is linked with "to say," with what is expressed and heard, with what is uttered and understood from the onset. Spoken or written, the word is Revelation: a sublimation of verbal-motor behavior. When the Elohim "take" Adam to place him in the Garden of Eden (Genesis 2:15), this taking is effectuated by the word. This is also the failure of Cain's "words" to Abel (Genesis 4:8 ) which prompted the fratricide. And likewise, finally, the fact that the world was created by ten words (in the rabbinical tradition the phrase: "In the beginning" is considered as one word, the tenth, which is added to the other nine); it is through ten "words," ten "commandments" that God gave Moses his Law on Mount Sinai." [On Being a Pagan]

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Wed May 28, 2014 8:23 am

It is retards like the Xts. and the Jews and the Muslims, who abhor idol-worship...

Heidegger spoke of the relation between thinking and thanking, the importance of the Hand in Poiesis which is a making, a sculpting... a drawing out of Phusis from stone, from earth - which is what Pagan Idolatry is;

Quote :
""The Greek for ‘to bring forth or to produce’ is tikto. The word techne, technique, belongs to the verb’s root tec. To the Greeks techne means neither art nor handicraft but rather: to make something appear, within what is present, as this or that, in this way or that way. The Greeks conceive of techne producing, in terms of letting appear. Techne thus conceived has been concealed in the tectonics of architecture since ancient times. We think of creation as a bringing forth. But the making of equipment, too, is a bringing forth. Handicraft.

The word techne denotes rather a mode of knowing. To know means to have seen, in the widest sense of seeing, which means to apprehend what is present, as such. For Greek thought the nature of knowing consists in aletheia, that is, in the uncovering of beings. It supports and guides all comportment toward beings. Techne, as knowledge experienced in the Greek manner, is a bringing forth of beings in that it brings forth present beings as such beings out of concealedness and specifically into the unconcealedness of their appearance; techne never signifies the action of making." [Heidegger]


Comapre the prohibition with the Semites:


"You shall not make for yourself an idol, whether in the form of anything that is in heaven above, or that is on the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I the LORD your God am a jealous God, punishing children for the iniquity of the parents, to the third and fourth generation of those who reject me, but showing stead- fast love to the thousandth generation of those who love me and keep my commandments."(20:4–6)


"Then God spoke all these words, saying, I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery. 1] You shall have no other gods before Me.  2] You shall not make for yourself an idol, or any likeness of what is in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the water under the earth. You shall not worship them or serve them; for I, the LORD your God, am a jealous God,
And the rest of mankind, who were not killed with these plagues, repented not of the works of their hands, that they should not worship demons, and the idols of gold, and of silver, and of brass, and of stone, and of wood; which can neither see, nor hear, nor walk: [Revelation 9]

Note: “Jealous” does not mean He is suspicious or distrustful, but that He demands exclusive devotion.

The warnings about idols extend from one end of the Bible to the other..

And I said unto their children in the wilderness, Walk ye not in the statutes of your fathers, neither observe their ordinances, nor defile yourselves with their idols. [Ezekiel 20]

Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and Him only shalt thou serve. [Matt 4-11]

“… abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood. [Acts 15]

And the rest of mankind, who were not killed with these plagues, repented not of the works of their hands, that they should not worship demons, and the idols of gold, and of silver, and of brass, and of stone, and of wood; which can neither see, nor hear, nor walk: [Revelation 9]

The Pauline Epistles contain several admonitions to "flee from idolatry"

Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things. Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonor their own bodies between themselves: Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen. [Romans 1-25]

For this ye know of a surety, that no fornicator, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and God. [Ephesians 5]

Put to death therefore your members which are upon the earth: fornication, uncleanness, passion, evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry; [Colossians 3]

Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these: fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,  idolatry, sorcery, enmities, strife, jealousies, wraths, factions, divisions, parties, envyings, drunkenness, revellings, and such like; of which I forewarn you, even as I did forewarn you [Galatians 5-21]



An idol is made of one who is worthy of veneration. Who has WORTH-ship...

The word ‘worship’ derives from the Indo-European root wer or uer – ‘to turn’. The starting point of idol meditation is to orient yourself to gaze at it, infusing your breath in it which in Turn comes alive to speak to you...
Ricouer's hermeneutics talks about 'doing away with idols,' namely, becoming critically aware of when we project our own wishes and constructs into things, so that they no longer address us from beyond ourselves as "other.", and we remain in our subjective solipsism. But there is a second kind of idolatry which is what I.E. Paganism was about.. the need to listen in openness to a symbol and thereby to allow creative events to occur "in front of" it, in front of our gaze on it, and to have its effect on us.

Its called Aletheia.

Idol is derived from the Greek eidos, form, and the root weid- in Indo-European, whose derivatives include guide, wise, wisdom, guise, wit, view, visa, vision, advice, clairvoyance, idea, history, story.

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Wed May 28, 2014 8:24 am

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Wed May 28, 2014 1:31 pm

Vilhelm Gronbech wrote in his book, The Culture of the Teutons;

“In the high seat, in the grove, and on the mountain, we stand face to face with a power which
seems never before to have forced itself upon us: that of holiness; but in reality, we have traced its
influence at every step. It is luck in its mightiest shape. The connection lies in the name, for heilagr —
holy — and heill — good luck or good fortune — are radically akin. From the point of view of form, the
one is a derivative of the other: heilagr is that in which heill resides; but the formal relation does not show
that the idea of the adjective should be later than that of the substantive. We can get nearest to the spiritual
kinship by viewing both as linguistic expressions of the fundamental idea wherein Germanic culture once
gathered the innermost secret of life in one sum; heill is humanity, and heilagr is human, in the widest
sense of the words.”

Basically, to the Ásatru (or heathen) world-view, the concept of the holy, health, luck, and
wholeness are all one and the same. They are all inexplicitly linked to evoke the power and restoration of
each other. To be holy, one had to be healthy, filled with luck (or megin), and part of an encompassing
wholeness of the concepts together. This is the background to the modern/ancient greeting “Heil/Heilsa”
used by modern heathens today. You are not just saying, “Hi.” or “How are you?” You are saying, “Be
healthy.” or “Be whole.”

The concept of the unholy is directly counterpart to the concept of the holy. The Old Norse word
for unholy was óheilagr and the Old English word was unhálig.
Again, in modern usage, Webster’s New Universal Unabridged Dictionary (1996) gives the
definition of unholy as:

Un·Ho·ly (un hō′lē), —adj. 1. not holy; not sacred or hallowed. 2. impious; sinful; wicked. 3.
Informal dreadful; ungodly: They got us out of bed at the unholy hour of three in the morning. [ bef. 1000;
Old English unhālig (c. D onheilig. Old Norse óheilagr)] —unholiness, n.

We can easily deduce that just as the word holy meant, “with luck”, “health(y)”, or “whole(ness)”
that the opposite being unholy meant, “without luck”, “unhealth(y)”, or “lack of whole(ness)”. So that
which is unholy is unhealthy, sick, without luck (or megin), and not whole or holistic. A major supporter
of this existed within Icelandic law were as a person who was declared an outlaw, then violated the terms
of their outlawry was referred to as being óheilagr. By becoming that last step beyond the harsh outlaw,
you became the opposite to that which Gronbech said in that to be heilagr was to be human. So, to be
óheilagr was to not even be human. They were considered far away from the sacredness of the inner
enclosure of society. They were the true outlanders.
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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Tue Jun 10, 2014 6:05 pm


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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Tue Dec 02, 2014 8:32 am

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More for the commentary than anything else.
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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Fri Mar 27, 2015 3:00 pm

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How enticing, to live in a world where animals, naturally selected and fit, are tortured and killed to allow human animals, who are protected and sheltered and unfit, to go on living for one more day of their despicable, miserly, sickly, pathetic life.

Enticing in the same way one is tempted by a toilet bowl with shit-stains, a kitchen sink full of pots and pans, or bookshelves full of dust.
No matter how one tries to ignore and forget it, one cannot.
He will have to go and clean that dirt away; he will go and order his chaos.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] a bookshelf full of dust.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] a kitchen full of dirty dishes.

[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] a toilet bowl full of shit stains.

Short distance between dirty study, kitchen and bathroom.
Is this not your home, or are you a visitor?
Do you not live here?

Clean away....

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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Sun Aug 16, 2015 6:14 pm



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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Mon Aug 17, 2015 3:11 pm

Walter Burkert wrote:
"If a man is able to draw near to the gods, as the priest Chryses with Apollo or as Hektor or Odysseus with Zeus, he can do so because he has "burnt many thigh-pieces of bulls" (Il. 1.40, 22.170;  Od. 1.66), for this is the act of piety: bloodshed, slaughter - and eating. It makes no difference if there is no temple or cult-statue, as often occurs in the cult of Zeus. The god is present at his place of sacrifice, a place distinguished by the heap of ashes left from "sacred" offerings burnt there over long periods of time, or by the horns and skulls of slaughtered rams and bulls, or by the alter-stone where the blood must be sprinkled. The worshipper experiences the god most powerfully not just in pious conduct or in prayer, song, and dance, but in the deadly blow of the axe, the gush of blood and the burning of thigh-pieces. The realm of the gods is sacred, but the "sacred" act done at the "sacred" place by the "consecrating" actor consists of slaughtering sacrificial animals...
Sacrificial killing is the basic experience of the "sacred". Homo religious acts and attains self-awareness as homo necans. Indeed, this is what it means "to act", operari (whence "sacrifice" is Opfer in German) - the name merely covers up the heart of the action with a euphemism. The bliss of encountering divinity finds expression in words, and yet the strange and extraordinary events that the participant in the sacrifice is forced to witness are all the more intense because they are left undiscussed." [Homo Necans]

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Mon Aug 17, 2015 9:05 pm

Nietzsche, Friedrich wrote:
One is no longer at home anywhere; at last one belongs back to that place in which alone one can be at home, because it is the only place which one would want to be at home: the Greek world!… A few centuries hence, perhaps, one will judge that all German philosophy derives its real dignity from being a gradual reclamation of the soil of antiquity, and that all claims to “originality” must sound petty and ludicrous in relation to that higher claim of the Germans to have joined anew the bond that seemed to be broken, the bond with the Greeks, the hitherto highest type of man.

Let us try to be Greeks then. Not these Modern, Jew-Christian forms of its decline, its disease, but those that lived in the light and knew not of this mental illness.

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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Tue Aug 18, 2015 6:11 am

A Hellene as Liantinis said.

"Do you want to have an accurate portrait of a modern Greek? Take the robe of a vulture and of a
crow. Take the stuffed bellies of the priests, the black frock of Makarios II, from Cyprus. And the
long beards of the monks, which hide the face like thick overgrown and unkempt fences hide the fields
beyond. And the covered up nuns, the other version of the Turkish veil, and you have got a faithful
picture of the modern Greek.
Now next to this dark and foreboding image, bring the image of the ancient, and measure the
difference.
Bring the shapes of the youthful bodies, well-built and proportioned. Ascending from Olympia and
Delphi, accompanied by the clarion sounds of silver cymbals. The beautiful sleeveless tunics,
appealing in their simplicity, and the flowing white garments. Sandals of fine leather, made to fit
strong ankles.
Bring the picture bequeathed to us by the ancient Greek women. Slim-lined with their thin belts, a
blue headband and deer-like grace. The Greek women of Argos and Ionia, slender in their short skirts
and unashamed. Racing on the mountains together with Atalanta. And sleeping in their final resting
places like the Euthydikos Kore.
All of them supported peacefully on some marble pedestal, at the head of a column, at the base of a
white cistern in the Agora. Surrounded by elegantly proportioned temples, bathed in sunlight and
azure skies.
Men, and gods, and statues, all one.
All these, so that you may compare the old and the new Greece, to consider and weigh them. And
put a northern European next to them, so that he may do a fair appraisal. He will have every right to
say: Clean air and daylight is not the same as putrid smells in the dark of night. You cannot mix
hyacinths and weed.
And they will eventually conclude their critique reprehensibly:
- “How presumptuous! How dare they ask us for the Elgin marbles back? Who do they think they
are? Those religious nutters.”
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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Wed Aug 26, 2015 7:16 pm

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Quote :
Quote :
"In that time, without the distractions of modern life, and aside from the ones of the essential, I have had sufficient time to ponder the present state of man. I am convinced it is a species that loves its servitude with every sense of their being. It is rare now to be free of distraction and obligation, more so at this time in history than in any other, yet I have never seen a being so lost and dejected without the weight of their chains to bind them. There is even an air of anger and contempt at their predicament of freedom, cursing the storm that has set them loose, the liberator that is ruin, and the only topic on their minds is the time in which their oppressive order might return. The prospect of another second to themselves is maddening for most. Everyone gossips and ventures guesses, literally in the dark, as if seers and wise-men deciding the fate of all at the crux of times." - Στρατηγός C.C. Conall, from 'Anamnesis' - Of Ruin.

The Order of Würm is dictated by the specific principles of PaleoEuropean spirituality remembered in the modern age and through its members, evolved as if timelessly transformed through our blood in the expression of tens of thousands of years unto now.  This means that a lot of our tenants exist from a state of mind that is staunchly in contrast with the mass humanitarian populistand globalist views which dominate and pervade almost every mentality, forWürmian understandings are both ancient and advanced beyond what exists in the present realm of reality. In this way, Würm is timeless and ever-flowing. In retrospect to our revelations on the concept of Origin, all must understand that the very inception of our people and the first manifestations of their spirit were driven to its unique evolutionary path by the amalgamation of elements and conditions of life in Paleolithic Europe. The list is vast and specific but we may understand it by the catalyst: Ice. This is why there is no more integral or powerful a symbol for Würm than Isa and is the inspiration and sacred symbolism of our very title. Through Ice, the first of our folk to step foot on the frozen steppe of Paleolithic Europe were faced with the highest challenges in the Natural current and were thus driven onto their path in the world. It was in the narrow river valleys and small patches of forest of Europe gripped in the flowing ages of Ice where the PaleoEuropean was driven to the unique way of Blood and Spirit that had never before existed within man in that manner. Pushed by the harsh extremes of a frozen world, it was here in Europe that man became the apex predator for the first time in constant climactic shifts testing both ability and the fluidity to adapt. In a world where the sun shown weak in shortened days and, if far enough North, would disappear entirely for months at a time, the PaleoEuropean was driven to total predation to ensure sustenance. It was with the dawn of the eternal hunt that PaleoEuropeans took the first steps toward not only a physically advanced evolution, but also the first conception of the Spirit. Through the cycles of all things which our first ancestors were a part, living became ritualistic and all things held symbolic power. Knowledge from the past became integral to survival: the elders told the tales of the spirit realm and could communicate with the ancestral spirits that would come to be deified with the natural elements, the blood became the source of all things and the mentality of the noble predator was born in man. In the month long nights of the extreme North for people tracking traveling herds, navigation by the stars began; the first time man looks up to the cosmic waters. It was in the light of the Moon which our mothers and fathers would hunt and stave off the dangers of the glaciated world. The herds migratory habits could be followed by the phases of the moon and thus the first calendars and festive celebrations of the seasons were conceived. In the deep darkness of the caves wrested from the bear by man, the first art is born, but not in the sense that the modern man knows it, but by the power, knowledge, spirit and ritual with which it was created and maintained over tens of thousands of years; revisited and retouched sculptures and paintings in the deepest places generation after generation for the energy the forces of all things gave to the murals and the power they hate on the fate of the future hunts. There was no separation of spirituality, ritual, hunt, knowledge and wisdom,family and folk; all things were interwoven and necessary to one another and it was through Ice that predation under the Moon and starlit skies that our clans became cognizant of their deepest spiritual depths and their highest physical abilities.It is with the Neolithic and beyond; the coming of mass agriculture (which started outside of Europe) the warming of the continent, the easing of conditions and excess of people where the first Sun cults are born, and the first expressions of 'civilization' are realized. With agriculture came surplus, first of food, then of people. Larger populations force spreading ofthe various races and the dilution of not only blood but Spirit and the loss of the power of the environment on the understandings of life. With the destruction of the hunt goes the basis for all our spiritual, esoteric and metaphysical foundations in the world and the end of the rise on the evolutionary ladder; the removal from the forces of the natural world and the disruption of the astral current. With the death of the Hunt and the forgetting of Isa and Máni comes also the slumber of our Origin. Without the consciousness of our Origin, the mind dulls, the Spirit becomes blind, culture declines and becomes perverse, our bodies weaken and shrink, reflexes slow, the Will becomes lazy and the work of ages of evolution and struggle by our people dies. Through civilization, the increase in the human flood brings the decrease in our collective connection to the realms beyond and the gradual forgetting of the esoteric powers of the natural world and the ritual nature of life. What was once an evolutionary and harmonic co-existence becomes a wasteful burden on all things and it is with the advent of mass agriculture over the past 12,000 some years and the coming of 'civilization' that the devolution of the European begins. It is for this purpose which I say now these elucidations about what our Order is and what it is not:


◾The Order of Würm is inimical to and condemns the idea of 'civilization', the sedentary life and urbanization, and any concept of 'imperialism' and 'universalism'! Our Order stands for the revitalization of the exceptional and forming of our clans that transform from the collective Wolven ranks to the Inner Circle of the Draconic Initiated which move forth from this plane in solitary force of Spirit!

◾The Order of Würm is inimical to the cults of the Sun! Our Order holds true to our Blutminne and the PaleoEuropean relationship to the various manifestations of the Lunar force. Our Order Heils the Hunter's Stars and the Wisdom of the Crown of Arianrhod; we navigate the black waters in Elathan's light and in the rank of Orion!

◾The Order of Würm is inimical to those who seek to live in the warm climates! Our Order calls for the physical effects of Isa just as it had on the provenience of our blood! Our Order seeks to be near to the giants of Ice and exposed to the evolutionary powers of the Cold!    


◾The Order of Würm is inimical to agrarian society! Our Order holds to the force of the predatory habits of our gods: the primordial ancestors and the apex predators and elements of our unique environmentally driven understandings of existence. Our Order follows the turning of the wheel in the flow of the astral waters!


◾The Order of Würm is inimical to any mass-movement, any form of universalism, and the very idea of politics in practice or thought in regards to the mass human collective! Our Order recognizes that there is no hope for natural restoration in an unnatural system. Our Order is the paradox of civilization! Our Order only recognizes the exceptional; those that pass the tests of our essence and take the steps beyond! Our Order is not political, our collective only exists in the bloodbonds and brotherhood of shared experience and overcome struggle!


◾The Order of Würm is inimical to the technocracy of the modern world and the enslaving dependence for the sake of profit over advancement in total contradiction to the purpose of technological evolution and the intelligent usage of tools! Our Order is in favor of the responsible use of all the most advanced technologies but as the means of complimentary advancement to physical and spiritual evolved maturity!

Würm does not seek any 'mass-movement' because Würmian principles do not recognize any conglomerations and thus, we do not support any of the virtues of the modern masses; nor does Würm suggest that one can turn back vyrð and live in the past of unchanging reality. Our power comes from the anamnesis of the ancients that rips through time and manifests evolved and everchanging through us. It is one thing to hold to the Spirit and another to be stagnant.Würm does not wish to live as the elders, only to think, feel and evolve as their Spirit dictated.Würm is beyond and it is Elite simply by its very essence. Again, I say, Würm is both ancient and advanced; it is ever evolving yet timeless and eternally itself at its core. Würm does not 'react' because our actions manifest from within ourselves and are not dictated by anything without us. Our virtues dictate that we are no more or less than we are in accordance with the Natural Flow.

Before you now is the Würmian Call in plain words once again:Be as the natural gods and the world that bore you! Remember and be as your forebearers before you! Be as your spirit commands within you!  


Heill to the Eternal Hunt and Heil to our Wolven packs;
Heil to the Elathan Light and Heil to the Draconic Path of Isa!Heil Würm! Στρατηγός Conall
by Appointment of the Grand Maestre and White Horned, commanding the Inner Circle of the Draconic Initiated
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Lyssa
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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Wed Sep 02, 2015 5:28 pm

Gaps, clefts, voids, cracks, were sacred to Hades/Pluto; and the sacrifices were offerings to "feed" the gap... a manner of affirming the void, of death.

Walter Burkert, Homo Necans:

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"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Fri Sep 04, 2015 10:38 am

Bloodsacrifice of the ancient world.

Culture erupted around graves.

Human history is the eulogy of our ancestors.

Higher love and bloodsacrifice are one.

We can not love without bleeding or cutting.

Cut yourself today with a thorn.


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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Fri Sep 04, 2015 4:14 pm

Paganism, as it is called in our time, or Aryanism or Indo-European culture, is a relationship,a love affair.
And like all love affairs it is about power balances - pulling/pushing...one moment it is full of love and the next hate may erupt.

How man relates to world is agon - love/hate.
Man resist, confronts, separates, from nature, but also accepts, embraces, endures, tolerates.

To man's intuition, the world can be counter-intuitive - to man's, as organism, ordering, world is Flux, producing randomness, to man's morality, caring, world is indifferent, and amoral, to man's subjectivity world is, and is, for man object/objective; to man's need to know, to control, world is unknowable, it is fluctuating, slipping away, falling away.

Paganism is this humble awe before world/nature, but into a capitulation, not a bowing down...as the Greeks believed in their Olympian metaphors of world.

At its root paganism is the loving, honoring of one's past/nature, through his ancestors, and since the individual is the last ring in that chain, he is the present/presence manifestation of this past/nature, paganism is love of self.
not blind, mad, self-flattering, love.
Not delusional erotic love, but lucid, rational, aware, love = agape.

Eros accentuates agape, as it does between a man and a woman, but it does not replace, or usurp agape, because this would make it a frenzy, an instinctual, and shallow.

Paganism began by believing not in ghosts and spirits, but in one's own dead.
The proto-pagans worshiped their dead, their ancestors, and they prayed to them for guidance, and help - and so essentially they were looking for guidance and help from inside of themselves - taping into their inheritance as it was present in them as genetic code.
Later they universalized their ancestors, and made them into metaphors for natural forces - calling them gods.

Not absolute, infallible, omniscient, omnipotent, one god, but forces.
Before them man was not a slave, not a submissive nothing, but both benefactor and challenger.
Man fought with and against the gods.

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Trixie Celūcilūnaletumoon

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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Fri Sep 04, 2015 10:44 pm

Question, have you ever found the Vril.
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PostSubject: Re: Paganism and natural order. Sat Sep 05, 2015 10:07 pm

Lyssa wrote:
Gaps, clefts, voids, cracks, were sacred to Hades/Pluto; and the sacrifices were offerings to "feed" the gap... a manner of affirming the void, of death.


Black Panther wrote:
Bloodsacrifice of the ancient world.

Culture erupted around graves.

Human history is the eulogy of our ancestors.

Higher love and bloodsacrifice are one.

We can not love without bleeding or cutting.

Cut yourself today with a thorn.



Nietzsche wrote:
"A crisis that purifies." [WTP]


Crisis:

Quote :
"early 15c., from Latinized form of Greek krisis "turning point in a disease" (used as such by Hippocrates and Galen), literally "judgment, result of a trial, selection," from krinein "to separate, decide, judge," from PIE root *krei- "to sieve, discriminate, distinguish" (cognates: Greek krinesthai "to explain;" Old English hriddel "sieve;" Latin cribrum "sieve," crimen "judgment, crime," cernere (past participle cretus) "to sift, separate;" Old Irish criathar, Old Welsh cruitr "sieve;" Middle Irish crich "border, boundary"). Transferred non-medical sense is 1620s in English. A German term for "mid-life crisis" is Torschlusspanik, literally "shut-door-panic," fear of being on the wrong side of a closing gate."


Riddle:

Quote :
"coarse sieve," mid-14c., alteration of late Old English hriddel, dissimilated from hridder, from Proto-Germanic *hrida- (cognates: German Reiter), from PIE root *krei- "to sieve," and thus related to Latin cribrum "sieve, riddle," Greek krinein "to separate, distinguish, decide".


Ritual/Rite:

Quote :
early 14c., from Latin ritus "religious observance or ceremony, custom, usage," perhaps from PIE root *re(i)- "to count, number" (cognates: Greek arithmos "number," Old English rim "number"; ). Rite of passage (1909) is translated from French rite de passage, coined by French anthropologist Arnold van Gennep (1873-1957).



Dionysos:
A crisis cleaves, and is also a gap.
Time is out of joint, and Cronos comes with a golden sickle.
Hades is also dionysos.
Crises claw and tear at you like maenads in panther-skins and eternal circles, and away in the sudden graceful leap or paralyzed with inertia, life and death is deterred-or-mined at the edge, all tooth and nail.
Round and round, it becomes a riddle...

"As he paces in cramped circles, over and over,
the movement of his powerful soft strides
is like a ritual dance around a center
in which a mighty will stands paralyzed." [R.M.Rilke, The Panther (1902)]


Chiron:
The crisis confronts us as a Riddle of hybrid or disjointed discontinuities.
Forms of riddling play throwing polarities against one another, bright/dark, hot/cold, life/death, and crafting rich lines... one way of holding them all together, the heavy gold, which drinks up a lot of energy... pain like vulture pecking forming scar-tissue.
A riddle is a sado-masochism, that can either collapse under its own weight [self-sabotage], or give into a breath-through [see you on the other side, immortality].

Apollo:
Ritual is Rhythm, Number that stabilizes by offering a sacrifice of correspondences [as above, so above].
(My mind to the moon, my eyes to the sun, etc.)
It tries to close the gap, without negating... but soon, a crisis sets in...
The ER purifies.


Chiron is birthed by Cronos in the form of horse, a night-mare, a crisis. The Plutonic healing is cathartic.
The opening of gaps - forgetfulness - is a precursor to health. Dissolution of old, weak forms shedding away to a becoming, a growth.
Chiron's hybridity is a formal riddle. Burkert [Homo Necans] cites the ancient I.E. rite of horse-sacrifice [including the story of the Trojan horse] which involved incubating the horse's head as healing the entropic time.
Horse as the symbol of time, the sun rising and setting as Apollo drives it as his chariot across the sky is an old metaphor. A glance into the absurdity of the world can be won only with an absurdity, a play, a riddle... and a peek of truth is caught in the lightness of playing although the riddle itself may be serious and deadly.
The solving of the riddle joins the fragments and fragmentations.
The Kenaz rune ' < '  is like an inward thorn or arrow upon oneself, like Chiron shot with a poisoned arrow.
The rune of knowledge is also the rune of wounds, rot, putrescence, burns, inflame-ation, scorching blisters, volcanic light, sacred fire of sexual generation (kennen: to know, to beget)...
Apollo the scorcherer and the sender of plague is also the enlightener and light of any hierosgamos, marriage of two things that is number, proportion, healing music, a re-membrance over the gap of forgetfulness.


ER is the crisis,
Overman is yet the riddle (the bridge of man and star, plant and animal),

and where the Hercules who plucks the golden apples, the Golden law, the seven seals of marriage to eternity?


Present problem:

Crisis is still stuck at meaning;

Air: Financial crisis [Money/code as the absent god],

Water: Midlife crisis [Xt. Love as the absent god],

Fire: Energy crisis [Mephisto as the absent god],

Earth: Identity crisis [Pleasure as the absent god]

Space: Mortality crisis [soulless Machines as the absent god]


In short: Hedonistic An-Nihilism.
An-nihil-ation of the zeal for grand purposes.

Mishima said, our concept of pain is intimately tied with our concept of beauty and beauty is only experienced in violence, in profound anguish (although one doesnt know its profound till after the storm's passed and what state it has left one in...)


Sheltering protects the average mind from being hit hard; nothing affects him but his immediate gratifications.
It remains *just* a financial crisis.
It remains *just* an energy crisis.
The link of one to the other and other and other... doesn't surface up as a whole ecological crisis.


Natural selection when the curtains of the artificial environments are opened and exposed:

How far can you expose it?

How far back, deep and wide a gap, a crisis can you break open?

In the Beginning was the Word, the Language?
In the End is the Laughter?
And Love, the gap, and the rope over the gap in between?, for we have loved too poorly...

The point in going around in circles and leaping back and forth in rephrasing same conditions and wrestling the same age-old problems with poems and prose and questions in diff. ways, like sisyphus, as absurd as it is... the 'churning of the milky ocean' makes the cream separate to the edges of the whirlpool of time...

The mythological swan sacred to Apollo was said to separate the milk from the water.

The panther dancing amidst the swan-song is a good re-creation...

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
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