Know Thyself
Would you like to react to this message? Create an account in a few clicks or log in to continue.

Know Thyself

Nothing in Excess
 
HomePortalSearchRegisterLog in

Share
 

 Creation/Destruction

View previous topic View next topic Go down 
AuthorMessage
Satyr
Daemon
Satyr

Gender : Male Pisces Posts : 36828
Join date : 2009-08-24
Age : 58
Location : Hyperborea

Creation/Destruction Empty
PostSubject: Creation/Destruction Creation/Destruction EmptyThu Dec 15, 2022 12:30 pm

How do they relate?

_________________
γνῶθι σεαυτόν
μηδέν άγαν
Back to top Go down
http://satyr-s-sanatorium.forumotion.com/
Satyr
Daemon
Satyr

Gender : Male Pisces Posts : 36828
Join date : 2009-08-24
Age : 58
Location : Hyperborea

Creation/Destruction Empty
PostSubject: Re: Creation/Destruction Creation/Destruction EmptyThu Dec 15, 2022 12:40 pm

Interactivity, i.e., flux, implies that process is this constant movement from destruction to creation, and from what is created toward its destruction.
There is no static, final point in space/time - no being.

An organism is constantly repairing the consequences of attrition, ands so is in a constant state of need/suffering.
Pleasure being a subjective, ephemeral state when the mind experiences relief - distraction- from this; usually proceeding from a state of escalating need/suffering culminating in a sudden gratification - experienced as ecstasy, pleasure.....before a new need takes its place.
An organism is constantly being confronted by destructive forces, and it is constantly resisting, repairing, requiring a constant source of energy - appropriating what it needs form other organisms on the consumer hierarchy...with plants at the bottom using solar energy to convent to organic: a modification of patterns.

Chaotic energies are entirely destructive since they cannot be appropriated, assimilated into any existing hierarchy of order.
They can only be converted to order, with great effort.
Lacking pattern they cannot easily be altered from one kind of order (matter/ energy) to another, because random (chaotic) energies cannot be captured, processed, incorporated.

Therefore increasing chaos constitutes the experience of linear time, from near-absoltue order towards near-absolute chaos.


_________________
γνῶθι σεαυτόν
μηδέν άγαν
Back to top Go down
http://satyr-s-sanatorium.forumotion.com/
Satyr
Daemon
Satyr

Gender : Male Pisces Posts : 36828
Join date : 2009-08-24
Age : 58
Location : Hyperborea

Creation/Destruction Empty
PostSubject: Re: Creation/Destruction Creation/Destruction EmptyThu Dec 15, 2022 12:41 pm

When life consumes other life it destroys an established hierarchy of order, breaking it down to a level that it can be processed and integrated into its own.

_________________
γνῶθι σεαυτόν
μηδέν άγαν
Back to top Go down
http://satyr-s-sanatorium.forumotion.com/
apaosha
Daeva
apaosha

Gender : Male Virgo Posts : 1837
Join date : 2009-08-24
Age : 37
Location : Ireland

Creation/Destruction Empty
PostSubject: Re: Creation/Destruction Creation/Destruction EmptyThu Dec 15, 2022 3:54 pm

Reality is interdependency. Phenomena interact and are thus discernible to eachother, detectable, influential.
Existence could be reduced to interactability. The only way to know anything about reality around us is via perception, which is limited and dependent on interaction between the bodies senses and the world. There is no available example of something static that does not interact, that is independent in this way. To be so is to be non-interactive and imperceptible. (It may exist, but we have no way of demonstrating it)
So we need to able to interact, to perceive, in order to have any degree of certainty that something exists.
To be considered existent a phenomenon must be capable of interaction in this way, including in the dimension of time.
Phenomena interact which is perceived as movement in time, the measure of such change. Past manifesting as presence, which can be defined as 'ordered' or 'disordered'. Chaos produces order; interactivity follows the path of least resistance to effect a system perceived as empirical reality, 'least resistance' being the inherent properties of phenomena and the effects their interaction or reaction produces: in other words the (temporary) order(s) that chaos is able to arrive at according to it's inherent nature as a fluctuating, non-static, unstable force.
Order is a sort of defined stable system that persists for a time before decaying into entropy, into 'chaos'.

This process is not even necessarily a cycle, as what is defined as an ordered or disordered system is basically arbitrary. Is the new order which arises, undermines and supplants an old order - chaos? Or is it itself order? A rotting corpse squirming with maggots - is that the collapse of order or the birth of order? An alpha being killed or supplanted by a rival - chaos or order? A civilization dying and falling into a dark age of superstition through decadence and disillusionment and loss of the will to go on - chaos or order?
A system has it's time and gradually makes way for a new system. Isn't the entire process orderly?

Phenomena interact, these interactions lead to more interactions, a system of interactivity develops, sometimes gaining in complexity until a system of increasing complexity becomes unsustainable at which point the system collapses under it's own weight and it's constituent parts return to the general flux where they may form more complex systems again, in the future. This occurs on the levels of a bacteria, of a human and even a civilization.
You could say that your observations about a societies success leading to lack of frontiers, leading to sheltering, leading to a dysgenic collapse are emblematic of this process. A behavioural sink is probably the natural outcome of a system that has outstayed it's welcome.
May something better be born from it's corpse.

_________________
"I do not exhort you to work but to battle; I do not exhort you to peace but to victory. May your work be a battle; may your peace be a victory." -TSZ
Back to top Go down
https://knowthyself.forumotion.net
Æon
Wyrm
Æon

Gender : Male Posts : 3581
Join date : 2014-03-25
Location : Outside

Creation/Destruction Empty
PostSubject: Re: Creation/Destruction Creation/Destruction EmptyFri Dec 16, 2022 4:44 am

Satyr wrote:
How do they relate?
If Matter can neither be created nor destroyed, but merely transformed, then the idea of Creation/Destruction must refer to something else, and it does. It refers to biological Life. It refers directly to the subjective perspective of the viewer, of the human life form. Therefore it is not Matter that is 'created' nor 'destroyed', but the life and consciousness of the person. This Life/Death cycle is then 'projected' unto the physical universe. The (human) organism believes, falsely, that because "I live and die", and "I am conscious", that the rest of the Universe must be the same way.

The Universe must be 'organic' like I am, like Life is.

This is false. It is part of the natural reaction to life's evolution of becoming Conscious. The organism is 'projecting' itself falsely unto the universe, Subject -> to Object. This is why evolved consciousness has a 'Nhilistic' tendency, to see in the universe "its own death", or the death-of-self, death-of-consciousness. This is what it calls Destruction. Becoming conscious, being born, living...This is what it calls (Pro)Creation.


This mistake is overridden, when a mind becomes mature enough to see and understand the 'cycle' of life (Paganism). Surely your body is born, dies, decays, rots, calcifies. But where is the "You" that dies? Where is the "Self"? What is the identity of the person, of the life form? What is remembered? Is remembrance enough? If an organism is 'remembered' forever, does it live eternally? Some cultures and mythologies believe so, and offer this path as its promise for immortality.

Once a mind admits to itself and concedes, the temperance and passing of life/consciousness, then it sees in Biology that life forms and carbon-mass is also not "Created nor Destroyed", but maintains a physical continuity.

Mass/Matter are not appearing from nowhere, "out of nothing", Ex Nihilo, but rather springing from Non-consciousness to Consciousness, becoming 'Awake'. Ironically this is twisted by Postmodern Nihilists in politics as "going Woke". This terminology is not a coincidence, as it overrides the natural, pagan, understanding of life and death as cycles. Energy and Mass are preserved, from generation to generation. Some genes & memes survive and continue reproducing...most others go Extinct. Most of life resides on its function, its purpose, its 'meaning' in life--most of this is focused around Serving a higher Purpose, a political hierarchy constantly in competition among the human specie.
Back to top Go down
Freyja

Freyja

Gender : Female Posts : 141
Join date : 2022-09-16
Location : Many moons away

Creation/Destruction Empty
PostSubject: Re: Creation/Destruction Creation/Destruction EmptyFri Dec 16, 2022 10:16 pm

Aeon wrote:

Quote :
Some genes & memes survive and continue reproducing...most others go Extinct.

Interesting.

Can you explain this in more detail, "the genes and memes survive and continue reproducting"?
Back to top Go down
Æon
Wyrm
Æon

Gender : Male Posts : 3581
Join date : 2014-03-25
Location : Outside

Creation/Destruction Empty
PostSubject: Re: Creation/Destruction Creation/Destruction EmptySat Dec 17, 2022 4:26 am

A minority amount of males successfully reproduce the majority amount of offspring. Meanwhile a majority amount of females reproduce a small amount of offspring. These are Mammalian heterosexual reproduction rates.

Consider how many sperm are wasted in a lifetime that do not reproduce.

Consider how many males, and females, go childless before they die.

Those that are successful, reproduce, and live. Those that continue on successfully, may do so for generations and centuries. But there are no guarantees. Adapt or die, Evolution.


In terms of memetics, Scientific knowledge is passed on from century, to century, to century, and is continually added upon. Science is "tried and true", usually. This is how the long-distant past educates children today, from innovative and intelligent men thousands of years ago. So successful memes continue to propagate indefinitely, as long as they are valued and upheld. Knowledge which is proven over time, is called Wisdom.

Parasites, which can be genetic or memetic, and hinder a host organism, are another method of survival, and is very successful.

Viruses are parasites, and have a specific biological reproductive method.

Sometimes Quantity wins-out over Quality, r-selective sexual strategies such as insects.
Back to top Go down
Kvasir
Augur
Kvasir

Gender : Male Posts : 3546
Join date : 2013-01-09
Location : Gleichgewicht

Creation/Destruction Empty
PostSubject: Re: Creation/Destruction Creation/Destruction EmptyTue Jan 03, 2023 7:06 am

Back to top Go down
Sponsored content




Creation/Destruction Empty
PostSubject: Re: Creation/Destruction Creation/Destruction Empty

Back to top Go down
 
Creation/Destruction
View previous topic View next topic Back to top 
Page 1 of 1

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
Know Thyself :: AGORA-
Jump to: