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Lyssa
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PostSubject: Surrender and Sexual Predation Sat Aug 31, 2013 8:25 pm

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*


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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Sat Aug 31, 2013 8:27 pm

You are one sexy woman Lyssa.

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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Sun Sep 01, 2013 8:35 pm

Satyr wrote:
Doubt made her all silent.
She turned and looked into the distance, pondering.

"I no longer serve the destiny of man. I belong to the sisterhood of the invisible God, who no sword can cut and no hands can hold. I have given myself to the immanent Chaos, against which no power can call itself great."


Life is one woman. There is also another.
She is Mnemosyne.

Entropy may be the most powerful thing that the feminine is taken to and against which all masculine power Appears to fall short. But nature too, in all that entropy carries a memory, preserves a Presence. This made Zarathustra utter there was a life within life, and joy is more primal than pain.
The order the masculine constructs does not wither away, when Vesta preserves his order, the sanctity of his order, that presence of his fire through her faith and memory. There is a re-membrance that guards the immortality of the genii, rendering the masculine spirit worthy of veneration.

And Sophocles said,
"Wild as you are, all that love you must love you still."



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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*


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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Sun Sep 01, 2013 8:39 pm

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Crowley, Alesiter wrote:
"It is ridiculous to ask a dog why it barks. One must fulfil one's true Nature; one must do one's Will. To question this is to destroy confidence, and so to create inhibition. If a woman asks a man who wishes to kiss her why he wants to do so, and he tries to explain, he becomes impotent. His proper course is to choke her into compliance, which is what she wants, anyhow." [Liber AL vel Legis, II:31]

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
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PostSubject: Surrender and Sexual Predation Wed Apr 09, 2014 12:15 pm

To a modern female, Surrender or Submission to Her Own Nature is shameful, as she personalizes the man before as an other, when what a man is, is but the affirmation of Her Own values. To surrender to a man, is but to affirm the conscious individuality of who one is. Rather than a matter of shame, it is the freest expression of one's being.
I mentioned in the Han thread,

"Its the self-conquering ones who can afford to let someone 'conquer' them;

"Privileges. - He who really possesses himself, that is to say he who has definitively conquered himself, henceforth regards it as his own privilege to punish himself, to pardon himself, to take pity on himself: he does not need to concede this to anyone else, but he can freely relinquish it to another, to a friend for example - but he knows that he therewith confers a right and that one can confer rights only out of the possession of power." [Daybreak, 437]"

To entrust yourself to another, is a conscious declaration of one's trust with one's own self.

These words are written for those 'feminists' who feel their language is not heard, whose voice has been stolen, disfigured, erased and feel voiceless...

There is no disconnect between mind and body.

A point of view was made here that the body once enjoyed doesn't offer as much value in keeping an other interested as a mind can, with its innumerable possibilities...

But every possible manifestation of the mind, and the space it opens, is a renewal of the body too.
We are one continuity.
To experience the body everyday when it possesses a mind that is dreamy, that is imaginative, that lives, feels, thinks, explores, is sensitive and open to varied experiences is to experience the body Too as a novelty...  

It is to experience oneself and the self of the other in its different avatars.

The body and self do not become a passive object when one gives oneself to another, provided of course the other is more than just his/her stomach.

Submission in itself doesn't involve objectification per se; its the Man-Animals as just Stomach who make it so.

The Modern female feels shameful about her own nature.
She is frightened of being objectified, of being owned, of being possessed.
She is defensive; this is nothing but a louder emphasis of one's value so that the other doesn't mis-estimate her worth.
Her speaking with nature.
Her shamanic whsipers with the earth and the trees and the birds.
"The dead sing through her mouth".
The earth comes alive in her hands. Her face speaks the wind.
It is never over when the man-animal says the dialogue is over.
Women speak even when pigs can't hear...
They roar even when pigs can't hear...

They are the systole and the diastole of memory pumping in and pumping out myths and stories that are blood carrying life from the other side of the moon.

Not machines.
Not mere animals.
Not dead when that which cannot be reduced to numbers and mathematics becomes unreal...

Man speaks.

But Woman is a song...

"The physical body or ‘organism’ (sadhaka-rupa) is the musical instrument or organon with which we can learn to become adept in amplifying, modulating and orchestrating the music of our psychical body (siddha-rupa).
Giving expressive bodily form (morphe) to feelings – bodying them - amplifies our awareness of them through resonance. The amplification of feelings through “morphic resonance” automatically leads those feelings to transform into other feelings. This is the essential principle of metamorphic resonance.

Only by expanding the expressive mobility of our body language can mobility of awareness be expanded, expressed and embodied. Any immobility of posture and body language constricts mobility of awareness.
Mudra is any way of intentionally giving expression to or imparting a quality of awareness by embodying it. The smallest movement can body and transform our awareness and that of others – that is the principle of mudra.
The word mudra means ‘seal’. A mudra is the ‘sealing’ of an inner mood or ‘disposition’ of our awarenees – literally setting a seal on it through a change or dis-position of our outer bodily bearing or posture, our way of ‘posing’ ourselves." [Peter Wilberg on Mudra Yoga,  http://www.thenewyoga.org/Lesson%206.htm ]

Submission is such a dis-position of Our Awareness.

It is singing Our Song.

Preys to man-animals and such stomach-predators may make us shameful, but they make us do so of our own nature.

The sovereign huntress is virgin like Artemis of the Hunt, because her state of mind is ever-renewing song...

Sovereignty is not to stop for nobody, but furiously pumping life with the velocity of the earth, keeping it from going dead, from going soiled, from going impure, from going to noise...  remaining Pure.

Chastity is being a passionate lover, a passionate lover is a loyal one.

To be loyal is not to perceive oneself an object, as a prey once enjoyed is discarded, but to experience oneself as furious life...

"Give me a heart more chaste than my mother's, and purer hands.” [Sophocles, Electra]


In myth, Artemis, the 'Virgin', the 'Sovereign' Huntress punishes the one who looks at her with his stomach... so we have the constellation [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]...

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*


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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Wed Apr 09, 2014 1:50 pm

Quote :
A point of view was made here that the body once enjoyed doesn't offer as much value in keeping an other interested as a mind can, with its innumerable possibilities...

But every possible manifestation of the mind, and the space it opens, is a renewal of the body too.
We are one continuity.
To experience the body everyday when it possesses a mind that is dreamy, that is imaginative, that lives, feels, thinks, explores, is sensitive and open to varied experiences is to experience the body Too as a novelty...

One looks for a different angle, climbs a peak, turns a rock to look on the underside. However, the awe inspiring moment of the first glance at a new landscape can only be lived once.
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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Wed Apr 09, 2014 3:48 pm

phoneutria wrote:
Quote :
A point of view was made here that the body once enjoyed doesn't offer as much value in keeping an other interested as a mind can, with its innumerable possibilities...

But every possible manifestation of the mind, and the space it opens, is a renewal of the body too.
We are one continuity.
To experience the body everyday when it possesses a mind that is dreamy, that is imaginative, that lives, feels, thinks, explores, is sensitive and open to varied experiences is to experience the body Too as a novelty...  

One looks for a different angle, climbs a peak, turns a rock to look on the underside. However, the awe inspiring moment of the first glance at a new landscape can only be lived once.



Aristotle and Leibnitz believed everything had its own innate entelechy called the Daimon.
It functions as the organism’s essential law of being, its inner design which determines its development or ‘fate’.  
The continual fulgurations of this law from moment to moment in its Spiral becoming, turning up around itself, Intensifies that original daimon-in-becoming.

Every spiralling out affirms and intensifies that point around which it turns to become...  
Every turning intensifies that original divinity of an entity.

The awe of that first moment which we lock in our experience is only intensified again and again, every time we Re-turn to it when we turn around it, and we turn around it because it was so inspiring.

In my view, its the ones who fear that they have nothing more to give once they give, who feel empty, are the ones who fear like they have been Used-up and exhausted when they surrender.
Feminist independence masquerades as this insecurity, which they end up blaming the man for "using" them, "objectifying" them.
The fear that they become nothing but void, mundane objects when experienced once...
Independence amongst such modern feminists guises its victim status.

The Sovereign Huntress is a Virgin because she does not doubt or fear the inexhaustibility of her own spirit, of her own abundance, her own potential. She is furious life always renewing, intensifying her daimon from falling asleep and going Unchaste.

A woman who does not fear the depth of her abyss but sees it as a source of spring, cannot fear becoming objectified when 'used' once.
Its true we can't return to the same moment twice, but everything that follows is an intensification of this moment becoming out, not its oblivion, not a loss.
Avatars of the same do not destroy the original awe, but even guard it.

A child too is an avatar of the self that you were, an intensity of you to whatever degree.
The same you cannot be had, life is fleeting, but the child guards your daimon.

The spider-web of life is similar.
Every movement of the string is an affirmation of that first point, of that first "rest" we trusted to build around.

Where that string takes us may not be as spectacular as the original view, a child too maybe a poor copy, a poor intensity of its parent, but the daimon itself, the moment itself is always there until the web of life itself comes apart...  and then we build again. We gather new intensity.

And what is objectification in the good sense, and not in the mouths of pigs and man-animals...?
Seeking that rest, that stability in a point, a moment, a person, a memory to build a life around to grow.
Its not reducing the other to staticity, to motionless lifelessness, but the affirmation of that same point over and over...
"A thing of beauty is a joy forever."


Does one get tired of life, seeing the same sun, the same moon?

Does life become less awesome sleeping with the same man or woman?

This is what Deleuze meant; Every Differance preserves a repetition of something that will not die, and every repetition can never complete itself to exact sameness, there's always a difference, a trace that exceeds.
A good relationship preserves both; the same awe of the first moment, and the awe of the different...

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*


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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Wed Apr 09, 2014 4:08 pm

The mind wants to preserve possibilities, as part of its ongoing Becoming.

The inferior mind cannot judge probabilities, as it has little conception of quality.
It banks on the primitive method of randomness, chance, guided by a very shallow perception, which usually comes in the form of a feeling, a sensation it can feel but not understand, an intuitive reaction, automatic, easy, genetic.
it calls this "spirituality" to retain its self-identification with being enlightened, progressive, open to ideas.

The "openness" is proportional to its understanding, or its sense of feeling ashamed of judging, when this has become ingrained in it from birth.

The answer "anything is possible" satisfies its insecurities, so it postpones or denies itself judgment, on the grounds that it might come back to haunt him/her, and that the negative, the absence of absolute knowledge (omniscience) makes everything, at the very least plausible.

This is the 'equality' ideal translated into cognitive contexts.
This becomes most evident in touchy subjects like sex and race.
Many of these "careful" minds, are careful only because they have been taught to feel a feelnig when thinking or using certain words.

For example, the anti-racist type not wanting to introduce the possibility of disparity in mind, as well as in body, inherited as a limiting potential, will comfort itself with ideas of chance.
The old: "a million apes typing will produce a work of Shakespearean magnitude" argument.

For these cowardly types, the idea that blind luck will compensate for any Dysgenic fallout that may be incurred due to uncontrolled reproduction and, in particular, due to race mixing.
The idea here is that natural selection, using judgment, is wrong.
The scales of "justice" must be tipped to help the least fortunate, in the genetic hierarchy pyramid, because in the end mixing, randomness, can produce accidental brilliance.
The effectiveness and efficiency of nature is intruded upon by manmade ideals, excusing themselves by resorting to a longer time scale to compensate for the efficiency lost.

Preserving possibility is felt s an expansion of possibilities. A hopeful feeling if one ignored probability and focuses of luck, or the "what if?" factor...which we also call "FAITH".

Faith is how fear, anxiety, is dealt with by the Modern Nihilistic Judeo-Christian, now in secular form, Zombie.
Faith remains true to the modern principles, the current meme, while at the same time tipping its hat to nature, to the genetic factor.

But the body knows what the mind refuses....or is ignorant of.
It floods the brain with chemicals, it produces automatic reactions, it forces the mind to take heed of emotions, sensations, even if it denies their relevance or, most of the time, forgets, or is ignorant of their presence.

A doe does not need to be taught why it has to get up and walk, shortly after it is born.
No lesson is offered...no consciousness necessary.
It acts under the genetic premise that it is in danger, though it does not know it is, or feel that it is.
It's brain need not participate...because the brain is a tool of efficiency, built upon the preexisting neurological, and organic networks.

A dumb bull need not know that fornicating with the cow will produce calves the farmer will slaughter.
A dumb cow need not understand that eating what the farmer gives it, supposedly for free, is not motivate by altruism, nor is it meant to benefit the cow more than the one providing this service of ease.

A cow is a cow.
And a bull is a bull.

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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Wed Apr 09, 2014 4:15 pm

@ Lyssa

The novel is attractive to the modern, drunk on hedonism and materialism which is its prime and only object/objective.
The object/objective becomes the satiation of a need, it then refuses to explore, or to define, using words to slither away....content to remain on this animal level of awareness.
Ironically these same types are the first to pronounce themselves progressive, modern, enlightened, proudly, living in the moment, childishly spontaneous, naive...infantile.
And when the shit hits the fan, as it always does, it is never their fault, because innocence is another way they escape ignorance.

Of course the novel will never satisfy, as nothing in existence is absolute, and so nothing can offer absolute salvation from need... absolute satiation.  
And because this absolute is missing - God is Dead - then anything and everything is good enough, or, so not good enough, that why not indulge in everything?

No discrimination required, as all is the same: imperfect.
An object/objective that can only satisfy them in the immediate.

They are mesmerized by the moment.
Heidegger calls it "captivation"...the mind, the animal, is captivated by the world.  

Like a cow, a bitch...you know?

This is the pure moment...the authentic.
Nothing must be permitted to blemish its effect.

No past, no future...like a fish, a common organism, entirely captivated by the moment.

The moment being a simplified/generalized piece of time/space, cut away from the continuum.
An abstraction.

The sensation, feeling, is pure. No motive because that would entail exploring past and potential future, shattering the magic.

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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Wed Apr 09, 2014 9:57 pm

I see this as another extreme dis/ease.

Surrender once to someone and you have lost something forever.

The fear of the typical modern feminist is her own vacuity, her own voidness because identity itself has been carefully/innocently built to successful trends, ideals, and it is all one has. And the exposure of 'self' once, feels like a total self-loss. Of being used-up. One then flits to the next and to the next in constant self re-invention to rebuild that layer, that sense of mystery.

Only insecure feminists would claim the one-time revelation in a surrender, the loss of mystery is the end of fun, happiness, the "excitement" of a relationship.
The end of seduction is experienced as self-loss.
When the chase and the lures become more thrilling and 'meaningful' in itself than the end purpose, surrender feels shameful, death of ego... the 'good part' is over... there is nothing to expect but disinterestedness from now on from the other - solution? Enjoy and discard them before they discard you. Hedonism. Momentariness. And this is what 'sampling' has become.

Feel vacuous inside and then blame or fear the other for objectifying you, taking you 'for granted'.

Didn't N. remark something on the difference between "seeming profound" and "being profound"? When cultural semblance passes off for culture, then the loss of mystery is experienced as an almost existential loss. The feminist and her hysteria [loss of almost one's uterus/womb from which the word hysteria comes... uterine rage as a self-productive loss] go together.

There are two views here actually.

1. Rituals turning things into empty meanings because of repetition.

2. Rituals creating something meaningful in its sacred order from the chaos outside.

The irony is its because we Are different everyday, we affirm life consciously each day. [we as in the really living ones as opposed to the zombies like - you know who..].

Loving the 'same' life, Surrendering to the same person with no fear of losing our mystery is a Ritual of the second order.
It is renewing affirmation, recreating/re-creating order.

Repetitions can both build meaning, and empty meaning.
The former creates code for a profounder frame, the latter becomes encoded in its own frame.

The sovereign huntress knows, when the awe and the seduction of her mystique disappears, when the pink dawn peels away, it gives way to A sun...
Awe can give way to beauty.

Nihilism is not the end of meaning when the value-giving veils disappear,, it can make way to create a profounder meaning.
Of course this is what you've been speaking about feminism and nihilism.

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"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Wed Apr 09, 2014 10:11 pm

Lovely theory, dear.
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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Wed Apr 09, 2014 10:27 pm

What's truth?

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Wed Apr 09, 2014 11:30 pm

According to whom?
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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Thu Apr 10, 2014 1:34 am

Satyr wrote:


The novel is attractive to the modern, drunk on hedonism and materialism which is its prime and only object/objective.
The object/objective becomes blablablablabla....

This humble arthropod begins to question whether the old man knows what hedonism is.
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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Thu Apr 10, 2014 1:40 am

Lyssa wrote:

Feminist independence masquerades as this insecurity, which they end up blaming the man for "using" them, "objectifying" them.
The fear that they become nothing but void, mundane objects when experienced once...
Independence amongst such modern feminists guises its victim status.

In my view, it is the ones who were born and raised to be victims who even feel the need to come to these observations.
You would not ask a man if he fears being objectified.
A victim surrenders. A predator uses.

Quote :

The Sovereign Huntress is a Virgin because she does not doubt or fear the inexhaustibility of her own spirit, of her own abundance, her own potential. She is furious life always renewing, intensifying her daimon from falling asleep and going Unchaste.

Then why doesn't she put out?

Edit: Typo... replacing "You would not as ..." for "You would not ask".


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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Thu Apr 10, 2014 5:00 am

phoneutria wrote:

One looks for a different angle, climbs a peak, turns a rock to look on the underside. However, the awe inspiring moment of the first glance at a new landscape can only be lived once.

Who is forcing you to climb on the top to glance at the landscape, and learn it's secrets. Especially if it ruins your expression of the forest. If you want to live dangerously and in the moment, then rome the forest and meet the bears and the deers.

If you read a book's ending before you start to read, then it's your own fault for ruining the suprise!
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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Thu Apr 10, 2014 7:29 am

Lyssa wrote:
I see this as another extreme dis/ease.
The dis-ease is produced by superfluity, the culture of safety, taken for granted as a right, and abundance, as an unnatural environment, entirely produced by man's intervention upon nature's processes.

It results in retardation, stunting, a worship of childishness.

A mind freed from the basic needs, feels lost, bored.
Things have to be revved-up, or games take the place of severity.

Having lost identity, and an object/objective, beyond the immediate, the mind makes the immediate its object/objective.

Lyssa wrote:
Nihilism is not the end of meaning when the value-giving veils disappear,, it can make way to create a profounder meaning.
Of course this is what you've been speaking about feminism and nihilism.
When it comes to relationships Nihilism rejects the world that would bind individuals with stronger bonds that the hedonistic.
No shared threat, no battle wounds, no blood lost together, towards a shared cause...the conclusion: recycled emotions, hyperbole, the focus on immediacy, on the shallow.

Happiness is the goal...and when it never settles for long, the mind loses interest in the world and makes its life a string of satiated needs....and the endorphin rushes it feels in recreating them.
The particular agency is not very important, because it's the sensation which is the goal.

The mind's perceptual-event-horizon is contained within a very shallow time/space frame.
It sees only as far as its next fix.

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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Thu Apr 10, 2014 4:33 pm

phoneutria wrote:
Lyssa wrote:

Feminist independence masquerades as this insecurity, which they end up blaming the man for "using" them, "objectifying" them.
The fear that they become nothing but void, mundane objects when experienced once...
Independence amongst such modern feminists guises its victim status.

In my view, it is the ones who were born and raised to be victims who even feel the need to come to these observations.
You would not as a man if he fears being objectified.
A victim surrenders. A predator uses.


I started a separate thread to distinguish the noble hunter from the stomach predators.
In life, no doubt everything is a resource for something or the other, and the use-value cannot be denied. Females, males, food, art all resources... "some want to use, some want to be used" as that song goes...
Men like Primal a.k.a. Eternal Savagery [a member here] define women as cum-slots, or sober it up in more decent terms as "The female is, essentially, a organic replication machine. Her job is to breed more warriors."
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When the use-value becomes the only value, then its those stomach-predators who get objectified (by) themselves. They become earthed, devoured by their inner female, and reduced to matter.
You reduce Yourself to another's use-value.

When Modern Feminists blame the other for using them, they merely reinforce the use-value paradigm.

To think in those terms use/abuse value is already to be trapped in the linguistic snare of the victim.

To equate,

surrender = victim,

use = predator,

is already to be encoded in the lang. of a victim. Monological thinking within a reductive frame, still caught in a materialistic discourse.

To think that way as in that equation, is already to have 'surrendered' to the Modern meme.

Modern Hedonism is the reduction, the dwarfing of oneself to pleasure/pain consequences.
It is to be enslaved by decisions of pain/pleasure that dictate identity.
Pain/pleasure, only consequences and effects of a way of living, seeing,, now cause, dictate how to live, see...
Modern Feminism is a continuation of this slave inversion.

To use the same metaphor I was commenting on recently elsewhere,
a beautiful body, a mind, best muscles, are built, maintained, augmented when they are exercised, and to exercise means, to Give Up a part of yourself again and again to grow more.

Great Health is not preservation but the constant giving up,,, relinquish/replenish... ad inf.
A beautiful relationship [with oneself, as with the other] is a Surrendering again and again, an Exercise...
This is why I say, sovereign Virginity can only be the ferocity of life, the terrible and vicious, ruthless pumping in and pumping out oxygen like a body to keep itself clean, chaste...
Chastity is an Asceticism and Asceticism is an Athleticism, an exercise, and not just etymologically.

To regard that the one who surrenders is a victim, is a confession of one's own exhaustion.
Modern Feminism is a confession of its weariness.

There is a surrender from exhaustion - you "give in" to what draws you; and you are drawn by it - drugs, assorted pain/pleasures, this, that... - the victim, the indiscriminate hedonist - you react.
Judaism, Xt., Islam, the religion of submission itself..., to faith, to commandments...

There is a surrender from vigour - you "let" the other dominate, secure enough for it. - the self-conquered, the discriminate sovereign - you resist reacting; you act.
Bacchae, the festival of surrender itself...
To LET life speak through you-as-life...

The stomach-predator only knows the language of submission.
The noble hunter recognizes the health in a voluntary surrender; grace is a strength.
Or to paraphrase N., what is beauty, but the condescension of power as grace...
...exactly what modern feminists don't have.

Is having gracefulness being a victim? Is that something to be ashamed of?

When nuances are lost, a whole world dies.



Quote :

Lyssa wrote:

The Sovereign Huntress is a Virgin because she does not doubt or fear the inexhaustibility of her own spirit, of her own abundance, her own potential. She is furious life always renewing, intensifying her daimon from falling asleep and going Unchaste.

Then why doesn't she put out?

If the notion is not obsolete to you, what is marriage?
Or what is a living together between a man and a woman?

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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Fri Apr 11, 2014 1:06 pm

My point is, what are you surrendering?

Quote :
If the notion is not obsolete to you, what is marriage?
Or what is a living together between a man and a woman?

Are you saying that the Sovereign Huntress is waiting for Mr. Right? Wink
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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Fri Apr 11, 2014 1:26 pm

phoneutria wrote:
My point is, what are you surrendering?

Trust.

"The point of marriage is not to create a quick commonality by tearing down all boundaries; on the contrary, a good marriage is one in which each partner appoints the other to be the guardian of his solitude..." [Rilke]

(The fuller quote goes...
"A merging of two people is an impossibility, and where it seems to exist, it is a hemming-in, a mutual consent that robs one party or both parties of their fullest freedom and development. But once the realization is accepted that even between the closest people infinite distances exist, a marvelous living side-by-side can grow up for them, if they succeed in loving the expanse between them, which gives them the possibility of always seeing each other as a whole and before an immense sky.)


Quote :

Quote :
If the notion is not obsolete to you, what is marriage?
Or what is a living together between a man and a woman?

Are you saying that the Sovereign Huntress is waiting for Mr. Right? Wink

So the sovereign huntress does believe in a Mr.Right? ;p

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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Fri Apr 11, 2014 2:44 pm

The extremely below average female's dilemma

---To find a man....



The below average female's dilemma

---To find a man, any man, and/or a substitute, through which she compensates without giving away too much.



The average female's dilemma

---To find a male who can be seduced by her sexuality, having power over him with that promise, but not to the point where he will be seduced by any female's sexuality.



The above average female's dilemma

---To find a man to feel equal, and or inferior to, so as to feel feminine, and also one that will not take advantage of this rare position.



The extremely above average female's dilemma

---To find a man....

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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Sat Apr 12, 2014 3:48 pm

Once again, dear, lovely theory.
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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Sat Apr 12, 2014 8:24 pm

The below average female's dilemma:
---To find a man who cannot be seduced by sex, thus not having power over him, but who she is also superior to.






*Note* just thought I'd fill in the gap in logical space, in the interests of completeness of theory. Hope that helps).
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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Sun Apr 13, 2014 4:08 am

Lyssa wrote:


Quote :

Quote :
If the notion is not obsolete to you, what is marriage?
Or what is a living together between a man and a woman?

Are you saying that the Sovereign Huntress is waiting for Mr. Right? Wink

So the sovereign huntress does believe in a Mr.Right? ;p

We shall have a word with miss Sovereign Huntress, and tell her to settle for Mr. Reasonably Compatible Wink
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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Sun Apr 13, 2014 6:07 pm

phoneutria wrote:
Once again, dear, lovely theory.
A more effective way to accomplish the same effect, would have been:
"Once again, dear old man, lovely story."

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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Sun Apr 13, 2014 7:15 pm

Except I am not talking to you.
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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Mon Apr 14, 2014 4:01 pm

phoneutria wrote:
Once again, dear, lovely theory.

You are not the first one to say s/he doesn't exist, dear. Unicorns only exist in fables... no?

Only the inexperienced would believe in green magic ;p

Its true.
S/He doesn't exist.
Its not like the allegory of unicorns surrendering only to virgins had any reality behind it...

It is just a lovely theory...

The Noble hunter is a fiction.

The Goddess is a vixen.

Aaaaandddd, rhyme!


"In his younger days a man dreams of possessing the heart of the woman whom he loves; later, the feeling that he possesses the heart of a woman may be enough to make him fall in love with her." [Proust, Swann's Way]



The way you can acknowledge the devil in me
I hope to god I'm talkin M e t a p h o r i c a l l y
Hope that im talking A l l e g o r i c a l l y...
Know that I'm talkin bout the way I feel
And I've never know a girl like you before

Never, never, never, never...  Wink

s/he doesn't exist...

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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Mon Apr 14, 2014 4:01 pm

phoneutria wrote:
Lyssa wrote:


Quote :

Quote :
If the notion is not obsolete to you, what is marriage?
Or what is a living together between a man and a woman?

Are you saying that the Sovereign Huntress is waiting for Mr. Right? Wink

So the sovereign huntress does believe in a Mr.Right? ;p

We shall have a word with miss Sovereign Huntress, and tell her to settle for Mr. Reasonably Compatible Wink


Lets.

We shall tell our earth-sister, the Sovereign Mistress of the Hunt, that she is more than ready for it, although she may think she is not...

Las/vicious eyes, fragile, but untrammeled.

She's a strong fortress, but could it be, the anemone grows languid from care about the gaper...?

"Hard people are weak people whom nobody wants, and the strong, caring little whether they are wanted or not, have alone that meekness which the common herd mistake for weakness." [Proust]

We should have a word with her about that...

We should tell that moonchild, she should try everything once.  bounce

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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Mon Apr 14, 2014 5:48 pm

Lyssa your previous two responses queerly remind me of a pædophile who used to frequent ILP forum, four years ago.

His moniker was "Jean". There is something dreadful and sickening the way you babble in inanity, gives me a feeling of dark revulsion.
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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Mon Apr 14, 2014 5:54 pm

Æon wrote:
Lyssa your previous two responses queerly remind me of a pædophile who used to frequent ILP forum, four years ago.

A pedophile is someone like you who comes to the playground when the little girls dont want to play with him at his place...

Quote :
His moniker was "Jean".  There is something dreadful and sickening the way you babble in inanity, gives me a feeling of dark revulsion.

Its babble because I wasn't talking to you, was I? But then again, thanks for proving you are a narcissist with that kind of presumptuous vanity.

Come to me for more attention, here kitty kitty...

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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Mon Apr 14, 2014 7:17 pm

Don't take it personal, there is just something decrepit and sick about your lack of style and grace.

Es-pec-ially the way you dec-o-nstru-ct words like an i-mbe-c-i-l-e-.
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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Mon Apr 14, 2014 7:27 pm

Æon wrote:
Don't take it personal, there is just something decrepit and sick about your lack of style and grace.

Es-pec-ially the way you dec-o-nstru-ct words like an i-mbe-c-i-l-e-.

Actually, that's true...

Don't take it personally, but to be very objective about it, you were very child-like... and I raped you.

That does make me a paedophile actually....  why would a lover spare anything,, I'll affirm that too..

Go play elsewhere now, you child-victim-you....

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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Mon Apr 14, 2014 7:52 pm

Ha, I knew it was you. Smile
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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Tue Apr 15, 2014 2:26 am

Call it metaphor... I call it bait.
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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Tue Apr 15, 2014 2:43 am

Lyssa wrote:

We shall tell our earth-sister, the Sovereign Mistress of the Hunt, that she is more than ready for it, although she may think she is not...

Las/vicious eyes, fragile, but untrammeled.

She's a strong fortress, but could it be, the anemone grows languid from care about the gaper...?

"Hard people are weak people whom nobody wants, and the strong, caring little whether they are wanted or not, have alone that meekness which the common herd mistake for weakness." [Proust]

We should have a word with her about that...

We should tell that moonchild, she should try everything once.  bounce

She will search earth and sky...
Her conviction undisturbed.
He eye firm.

She will find one such man...
Lay on him all of her myrr.
Reaffirmed.

Then with time, realize
Her love was no more than a...
Metaphor.
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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Fri Apr 18, 2014 3:27 pm

phoneutria wrote:
Call it metaphor... I call it bait.

Doesn't matter what you call it, but If you call it as Mere metaphor, Mere bait...



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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Fri Apr 18, 2014 3:29 pm

phoneutria wrote:
Lyssa wrote:

We shall tell our earth-sister, the Sovereign Mistress of the Hunt, that she is more than ready for it, although she may think she is not...

Las/vicious eyes, fragile, but untrammeled.

She's a strong fortress, but could it be, the anemone grows languid from care about the gaper...?

"Hard people are weak people whom nobody wants, and the strong, caring little whether they are wanted or not, have alone that meekness which the common herd mistake for weakness." [Proust]

We should have a word with her about that...


We should tell that moonchild, she should try everything once.  
She will search earth and sky...
Her conviction undisturbed.
He eye firm.

She will find one such man...
Lay on him all of her myrr.
Reaffirmed.

Then with time, realize
Her love was no more than a...
Metaphor.



And was she Mere metaphor herself?


I addressed this same issue in the anarcho-primitivist thread; but to present it differently in the context here, there is a nihilism that stems when words are fluid and a certain kind of man then begins to desire a "world that never changes"...   a world where that "first moment" and its experience will never get eroded and washed away... and he wishes he could hold on to it forever...

And there is a nihilism that stems when words are solid and immediacy with the moment is lost, experiences become objectified and one is no longer able to do justice to that "first moment" which is irreproduceable again -

Nietzsche and Zerzan respectively:

Nietzsche wrote:

"Man seeks "the truth":a world that is not... deceptive, does not change, a true world-a world in which one does not suffer;
contradiction, deception, change--causes of suffering!

Contempt, hatred for all that perishes, changes, varies whence comes this valuation of that which remains constant? ...the desire for a world of the constant.

Happiness can be guaranteed only by being; change and happiness exclude one another. The highest desire therefore contemplates unity with what has being.

The real primum mobile is disbelief in becoming, mistrust of becoming, the low valuation of all that becomes-

What kind of man reflects in this way? An unproductive, suffering kind, a kind weary of life. If we imagine the opposite kind of man, he would not need to believe in what has being; more, he would despise it as dead, tedious, indifferent- to what extent one can endure to live in a meaningless world because one organizes a small portion of it oneself?" [WTP, 585]


vs.

Zerzan wrote:
"Language refutes every appeal to immediacy by dishonoring the unique and immobilizing the mobile.

Language is the reification of communication... reification is a sclerosis...

Language itself corrupts..." [Running on Emptiness]



In the first case, he feels the continual transference in the metaphorical activity Erodes away vitality, like the waves carrying over each other one after the other like a metaphor erode the rocks in their momentum of contact with it... and he wishes the waves would stop.

In the second case, he feels the continual transference in the metaphorical activity Encrusts vitality, like the waves carrying over each other one after the other like a metaphor sediment and deposit mud that slowly turn into rocks... and he wishes the waves would stop.

In either case is a man who is exhausted with the world of becoming, with reality as it is.

Like I said, "Modern Feminism is a confession of its weariness."

This dovetails with what Sloterdijk said about Cynicism:

"To act against better knowledge is today the global situation in the superstructure; it knows itself to be without illusions and yet to have been dragged down by the "power of things. ... a new attitude towards objectivity."

The Cynic, a weary soul from a kind of jaded sheltering, because nothing imposes a price on it to make it something to care about.
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In other words, we have two kinds of modern feminists dovetailing with the two kinds of men above:

a. That kind of modern feminist who detests change because she is weary, and so seeks the most immortal changeless entity. She wants a God and finds man ridiculous, ephemeral, not good enough and laughs at him.
And because she can't find such a God, and knows she'll never find one, her cynicism pushes her to a hedonism - she begins to enjoy herself in self-abandonment, as everything and everyone short of God is trivial now, and nothing really matters save her own pleasure.

b. This kind of modern feminist who detests change because she is weary, and so seeks to never entertain anything more than the momentary, the immediate, as all else is reification, objectification. She wants a man and is disappointed that man soon turns to God... he becomes heavy, encrusted, unchanging, and she laughs at his becoming so, she laughs at his symbolizing Order, she laughs at her own self as well.
And because she can't find such a man who is 'light', and knows she'll never find one who "will stay" light, she uses her cynicism to justify her hedonism - she begins to take nothing seriously as it tampers with her sense of justice to the immediate, to that unique moment, to strings of such moments... she can't afford to take any man, even herself, seriously for more than that moment although that momentary affirmation maybe a passionate and genuine one, use-and-move-apart, use-and-move-apart... nothing really matters save her own pleasure.


In the first case, cynicism is the effect of her conflict with reality,,, in the second case, cynicism is used to justify her conflict with reality.

In the first case, nothing can Make her happy,, in the second case, nothing can Keep her happy.
The fantastic film 'Revolutionary Road' is an example of the first case of feminist cynicism,,,, and Sweet November, the second...

Where does that leave the Sovereign Huntress?

Merleau-Ponty describes a phenomenon via painting;

"The perspective drawing is not first of all perceived as a drawing on a plane surface, and then organized in depth. The lines which sweep towards the horizon are not first given as oblique, and then thought of as horizontal. The whole of the drawing strives toward its equilibrium by delving in depth. The poplar on the road which is drawn smaller than a man, succeeds in becoming really and truly a tree only by retreating towards the horizon. It is the drawing itself which tends toward depth as a stone falls downwards." ['Space', Phenomenology of Perception]

Meaning, the transference in the metaphorical activity of the poplar becoming a tree destroys neither poplar, not tree...   because one has Health to maintain both. No weariness.

The opposite of cynicism is not 'immediately'  romantic naivete, or being less-experienced; its merely a question of health, of 'chastity' - keeping pace with reality as it is.
I call it a sanguine-pessimism, while you and Satyr see the world similarly, except your responses to this cynical perception of you both is different.

I believe Satyr is just as cynical as you, but when he says, 'Live Lightly' and when you say 'I am light',  this "light" means two different things; his is one of 'ascetic' Balance:


Satyr wrote:
"Live lightly. Like a Spartan.

Every purchase requires upkeep and a constant payment for preservation. When too much is owned then the owner becomes a slave to his possessions.

In modern man's rampant consumerism he purchases unneeded items which become chains around his feet.
Many men of wealth live as they did when much poorer, with the only difference being, that now they are surrounded by a better quality of objects.
What is the difference between a chain of metal and a chain of gold?

The only thing of worth that wealth can really purchase in this culture, is man's freedom from it.

Less is more.

Simplicity is the key to enrichment.

In order to live lightly one must be discriminating...and unaffected by what is deemed inferior or useless, indifferent to the superfluous.

Let 'Live Lightly', be our mantra.
Asceticism is our faith.

Our purpose is self-sustenance as it is the path towards a greater degree of independence, and the clarity this offers.

We submit to its costs, knowing that no final destination will be reached, finding empowerment in the exercise, finding identity and purpose in the journey towards what we shall never reach, passing on the burden to an other, and he to an other still – we make of ourselves a worthy link in a chain, desiring to break it.

We refine our needs, identifying the ones which we cannot do without and casting aside all others as extraneous or as possible future vices, if and only if we have superfluous energies to sacrifice when answering their call.

We, first, determine our elemental obligations to our own biological sustenance, and we strive to ensure a steady stream of them towards our forever partial and fleeting fulfillment, before we dedicate our excesses to luxuries and passing distractions.

We do not deny ourselves pleasure, when and if it is accessible, but we evaluate its price. We do so based on a cost/benefit analysis of the situation avoid, as much as possible, of emotional and instinctual considerations.

We are weak, we are need incarnate, but this need not be absolutely binding – we are masters of ourselves or we are mere beasts.

Our needs dictate the choices, but they do not decide.

We are free only as much as we know, understand, and can harness this lack towards our destination.

Most of all we are independent of the other’s judgment, because (s)he is not what decides who and what we are, but only what decides within what confines our self will construct itself.

We go directly to the source and do not submit to the intervening substitutes for it: as in, we do not tolerate forgeries of our species or the particular social and cultural searches these types ascribe to – we look for authenticity, often expressing itself with arrogant humility and a cruel kindness, as a method of filtering our the pretenders.

First, and foremost, we are alive…then we are conscious of being alive…then we are conscious of being conscious of being alive.

All other categories are secondary and privy to our own evaluations – in this case we sometimes feel more kinship with a dog than with one whom is, supposedly, of our own species.

‘LIVE LIGHTLY’ my friends; live like a Spartan but think like an Athenian.
The balance of a good life.

I bet a fish swimming around in its fishbowl looks outside and thinks: ‘Look at that creature trapped in the four sided room. Thank god I’m free to swim around in my ocean.’
You spend your life chasing social status or luxuries or goals you’ve been told are worth while and meaningful and you’ll pay for it with life itself. Time is all we have, how we use it and for what we exchange it for determines our quality and wisdom.
Discriminate, discriminate; become frugal in your tastes and snobbish in your relationships. Don’t eat anything that is served-up and then call your full belly the essence of happiness.
Distinguished tastes leads to efficiency and value. You drink anything alcoholic that comes in a bottle and you become a decrepit alcoholic, sip the nectar of gods and choose according to bouquets and quality and you will rejoice in simply enjoying a drink.
Stop and watch the sunset. You will not see many more of them.
What makes life worth living?
People friends, people not objects.
Surround yourself with good quality people and call that your decadence.
Objects actually take away enjoyment by requiring much too much effort to be acquired and maintained. They wind up owning the owner.
Objects weigh you down.


Experiences.
In the end we are the sum of our experiences and it is these we take with us and these we value the most when we grow old and weary.

At Delphi, is written Nothing in Excess."

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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Fri Apr 18, 2014 3:30 pm

Æon-Turk wrote:
Ha, I knew it was you. Smile


I too see a pattern with this Turkey.

For anyone on this forum with a long memory, recall how PD accused Recidivist in the dungeon once of being MonoExplosion's sock-puppet and a 'pedophile' he had observed in some forum, simply because Recid. asked him to hang out on ILP...
That thread has vanished in the dungeon, surprise...

In all frankness to Recid., I did wonder why Recid. never defended himself or countered anything...

But now I see its a pattern.

Anyone who makes PD feel threatened will be accused of being

a. stalker

b. plagiarizer

c. someone's sock-puppet

d. pedophile


Neat.

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"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Fri Apr 18, 2014 3:44 pm

Lyssa wrote:
And was she Mere metaphor herself?

The "mere" bait, yes.

Like "spontaneous" or "just because".
It implies an understanding, but only alludes to what it cannot present, by stating the obvious.

All language being symbolic.

The ambiguity allows for a later defensive: "You misunderstand" or "I did not say, or mean, that."
The prose, prosaic, for its own sake.
Art for art's sake.

Art referring back to art.
The word, the symbol, referring back to symbols.
Connection to reality, to the phenomenon, lost in a circular noetic device.


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PostSubject: Re: Surrender and Sexual Predation Fri Apr 18, 2014 3:54 pm

I identify patterns in my opposition. It almost always is the case that the "same old players" hang around and advocate the same points, representing a lack of versatility as well as a lack of learning or curiosity.

At the very least, Lyssa has a perverted mind of sorts. Patterns are not ironic, but the opposite. Patterns are predictable, and the essence of prediction.

In this case, identification of players with more obvious types of motives.
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