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Satyr
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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Tue Sep 04, 2012 7:28 am

The point being that Synchronicity is man relating to manmade conceptions.

The stars, the planets, do not give a shit about how humans perceive them.
The forces involved are not unconscious natural ones, but psychic in that they are founded no human psychology and only relevant when all involved share in the culture, and the symbols it has incorporated within its contexts.

The role certain letters play has to do with the nervous system's processes in creating the sounds they represent; the shapes have to do with primordial fears concerning particular organisms, such as snakes, or events, such as floods or lightning.

Symbols are only relevant within human environments (social systems, political systems, cultural systems etc.) and they are no more than a rudimentary form of language.
Language began as pictorial representation. the earlier forms of writing were images, or shapes insinuating images.
Later they became more abstract representing sound or even more so when mathematics enters the picture representing a concept (singularity-1 <> void-0).

The connections made between human concepts, abstractions and phenomena are human connections. It offers the mind a sense of understanding, alleviating the anxiety towards the unknown or the randomness which events, phenomena, occur.
As entropy increases chaos, or randomness increases, making the anxiety increase proportionally.

Certain more weak, fearful, minds tend to go overboard with this.
Paranoia is what it is called.
They begin connecting random natural events with manmade constructs, trying to reestablish order in their world.
For them it is more frightening that phenomena occur at random, or due to causes too complex for any mind to envision or calculate (like a die role), that they would rather attribute them to evil forces rather than to the unknown and the unpredictable.
At least with "evil" you can hope to predict and to protect yourself.

The connection of certain symbols to psychological, emotional, reactions is so strong that Jung formulated the idea of the Collective Unconscious founded on them.
It is the commonality of the human experience which makes certain creatures take-on the symbolism they do, or certain natural events take on a common heritage, like the great deluge.
Flood myths are ubiquitous because early man settling beside rivers and lakes experiences the seemingly randomness of floods for centuries before he learned to connect them with moon and star cycles.

If allowed to dominate the mind - a mind wanting desperately to create order in its chaotic environment (this exposes more about the individual involved than she can imagine) - then such a mind will try to find a pattern in about any piece of information. The show size of someone might be used for a numerological insight, or what place he vacations...anything.
The goal here is to find connections and in them patterns that will make the unknown known.

This goes back to how primordial man tried to make his way in nature. This is why similarity, or uniformity, is so powerful a notion amongst the liberals or those seeking peace and tranquility and an escape from the chaos and violence of nature.
When man evaluates an alien creature what does he do? He seeks in it elements, characteristics, behaviors he recognizes in himself. He seeks the familiar to make the unknown source of anxiety, known and so less threatening.
This is why amongst humanists it is the similar which takes precedence over any divergence. No matter how small the similarity is it overpowers the different so as to create parity, commonality, the common.

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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Tue Sep 04, 2012 8:29 am

Except Carl Jung never saw it as psychosis, instead he gave it a method and showed great personal interest.....

http://www.carl-jung.net/synchronicity.html

Of course, you could argue that this crazy woman sitting in his office already saw the beetle and weaved a very convincing story around it....
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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Tue Sep 04, 2012 8:37 am

Satyr wrote:


Symbols are only relevant within human environments (social systems, political systems, cultural systems etc.) and they are no more than a rudimentary form of language.
Language began as pictorial representation. the earlier forms of writing were images, or shapes insinuating images.
Later they became more abstract representing sound or even more so when mathematics enters the picture representing a concept (singularity-1 <> void-0).

The connections made between human concepts, abstractions and phenomena are human connections. It offers the mind a sense of understanding, alleviating the anxiety towards the unknown or the randomness which events, phenomena, occur.

Very true.

And I'll say there are some authentic connections and organic archetypes that are specific to specific natures, environments, beliefs that grows together with people and their culture - how they interact with nature,,, and then those connections that are simply 'reduced' out using anything similar and common to tie them together. Poison's video on that man simply equating Aten with saturn falls in the latter.

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"Apophenia is the experience of seeing meaningful patterns or connections in random or meaningless data.
The term was coined in 1958 by Klaus Conrad, who defined it as the "unmotivated seeing of connections" accompanied by a "specific experience of an abnormal meaningfulness", but it has come to represent the human tendency to seek patterns in random information in general (such as with gambling), paranormal phenomena, and religion.

A common example of perceived, but non-existent pattern are paranormal sightings, including sightings of ghosts, Unidentified Flying Objects, cryptozoology, etc., which may be due to apophenia.

The attempt to foretell the future, present, or past by finding patterns in animal entrails, tossed sticks, or by picking random passages from a holy text are often cited as examples of apophenia. A more extreme example is the pareidolia associated with finding the faces of religious figures in pieces of toast, the grain of cut wood, or other such patterns.
Recent real-world examples include the finding of a cross inside a halved potato; the appearance of Jesus and Mary inside a halved orange; and the appearance of Jesus' face on a piece of toast, in the frost on a car window, and inside the lid of a jar of Marmite.

Synchronicity
Carl Jung coined the term synchronicity for the "simultaneous occurrence of two meaningful but not causally connected events" creating a significant realm of philosophical exploration. This attempt at finding patterns within a world where coincidence does not exist possibly involves apophenia if a person's perspective attributes their own causation to a series of events. "Synchronicity therefore means the simultaneous occurrence of a certain psychic state with one or more external events which appear as meaningful parallels to a momentary subjective state". (C. Jung, 1960)

Pareidolia is a type of apophenia involving the perception of images or sounds in random stimuli, for example, hearing a ringing phone while taking a shower. The noise produced by the running water gives a random background from which the patterned sound of a ringing phone might be "produced". A more common human experience is perceiving faces in inanimate objects; this phenomenon is not surprising in light of how much processing the brain does in order to memorize and recall the faces of hundreds or thousands of different individuals. In one respect, the brain is a facial recognition, storage, and recall machine - and it is very good at it. A byproduct of this acumen at recognizing faces is that people see faces even where there is no face: the headlights & grill of an automobile can appear to be "grinning", individuals around the world can see the "Man in the Moon", and a drawing consisting of only three circles and a line which even children will identify as a face are everyday examples of this."

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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Tue Sep 04, 2012 8:39 am

Stupid people can't find patterns, this is why they score low on IQ tests, which are based pretty much in entirety of them. Everyone give Satyr a big hand for standing up for the ones who are more than welcoming to his ideas that patterns, and quite commonly IQ tests, do not matter and/or are not accurate because they don't understand them.

We're living in an age where all cultures and beliefs are coming together and forming a massive scale of collective unconscious. Whether it pertains to China or Spain and ties into German folklore doesn't matter- they are connected in a preexisting order. It's actually not new, we're simply tapping into an essence that is ever present. I know many geniuses, one in particular, who has found numerous connections and meanings in the languages and how they correlate.
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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Tue Sep 04, 2012 8:50 am

Poison IV wrote:
Stupid people can't find patterns.

Exactly; people create meaning; there is no 'God' out there who weaves pattern and 'purpose' and meaning into things.

There is no pre-existing order that God created.

And who is this 'genius' you speak about?

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"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Tue Sep 04, 2012 9:03 am

Whether you want to believe G-d did it or not is irrelevant....
However, there is proof that people, not necessarily with higher intelligence but the highest intelligence, tend to believe in higher intelligence. If Jews, in your mind, developed the idea for G-d, the one and only, then intelligent people are prone to believe that their patterns lead to a higher order. Keeping in mind Carl Jung also had Jewish heritage...
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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Tue Sep 04, 2012 9:08 am

No, people with lower intelligence tend to believe in "higher intelligence". they covet what they lack.
The churches are full of morons.
Most intellectuals are atheists or agnostics.

The very term "higher" stinks of stupidity.
To a dog a man has a "higher intelligence" without it being omnipotent or omniscient.

Absolute intelligence is what retards pull out of their anus.
It consists of going outside the time-space paradigm to projects what is lacking within it.

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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Tue Sep 04, 2012 9:13 am

Sorry Satyr, you're wrong on this :p

Ashkenazi Jews still have the highest intelligence and share a faith in G-d.
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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Tue Sep 04, 2012 9:18 am

Poison IV wrote:
Whether you want to believe G-d did it or not is irrelevant....
However, there is proof that people, not necessarily with higher intelligence but the highest intelligence, tend to believe in higher intelligence. If Jews, in your mind, developed the idea for G-d, the one and only, then intelligent people are prone to believe that their patterns lead to a higher order. Keeping in mind Carl Jung also had Jewish heritage...



When I watch flowers blooming at certain time of a season, when the sun is at a certain position, when the frogs are croaking in a certain pitch, and stars allign in the sky in a certain definite shape we call the constellation, and when this repeats, each due to the limitations of its own being, its own quanta of force being unable to exceed beyond a certain limit,... this appears as a repetition and this repetition while not exactly the same every time it re-occurs, is perceived by the mind as a pattern. Spring becomes a 'symbol' for life and high activity, etc.

The more fluid and less abstracting a pattern is, the more organic is the language and meaning embedded, making the person more intelligent, and discriminating and aware of how one thing here affects a whole ecology... he is able to survey a longer chain of interactions, etc.

The rest of equating and reducing two symbols like the swastika and the cross for example simply because they both have two intersecting lines! is ridiculous, although I have read books on how Christ was perceived as the pagan Solar God by some and the cross was fashioned after the pagan sunwheel and what sacrifice meant to the pagans, and the cross and swastika therefore meaning 'similar' symbols of sacrifice. This is absurd reduction and juxtaposing of two different cultures, two different peoples with two different rates of flow.

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"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Tue Sep 04, 2012 9:22 am

I was reading the other day about the cross and it's origins- people do come up with bizarre, illogical theories for how it came about.
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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Tue Sep 04, 2012 9:30 am

Poison IV wrote:
Sorry Satyr, you're wrong on this :p

Ashkenazi Jews still have the highest intelligence and share a faith in G-d.
Ha....and are the most slavish and raised in a victim-psychology culture.

Intelligence can be warped and stunted...moron.
Retard...Ashkenazim intelligence is about percentages within a population not an indication that they have the highest...you simpleton.
These percentages went up after the Second World War...because all the dumb Ashkenazim were killed...or a large portion of them.

What's your I.Q. dear?

The dumbest of the dumb believe in Higher Powers...even amongst the Jews the more intelligent are prone to being atheists, secular humanists.

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PostSubject: x Tue Sep 04, 2012 9:32 am

Poison IV wrote:
Sorry Satyr, you're wrong on this :p

Ashkenazi Jews still have the highest intelligence and share a faith in G-d.

Creating Order, and Finding Order As If it already exists are two different things. I.Q. tests are simply devised on the latter. Can you not see any difference in a world out there with no meaning and a piece of paper that puts two triangles in one direction and then asks what follows next logically...?! LOL

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PostSubject: Synchronicity Tue Jul 29, 2014 5:13 pm

This is a discussion partially copied from ILP. I think it's important for the modern philosopher to have a good technical perspective on phenomena that seem scientifically trivial, but carry great subjective weight. I'll use the OP as a starting point.



Pandora:

Synchronicity is an experience of an event or group of events as meaningfully related to the experiencer (a meaningful coincidence), when such events are unlikely to have a(n) (outward) causal relationship. I think most people have had such an experience to one degree or another at least once in their life. Sometimes, the meaningful coincidence is minor enough that it is noticed by the individual, but dismissed. Sometimes the experience affects the person and causes him to change his beliefs or attitudes, and sometimes it is so forceful upon the mind that it may even change a course of person's whole life.

In an attempt to explain this psychic phenomenon, I think most literature too readily points a finger at the sky using it as evidence of conscious universe, or god, or some other divine force out there, interacting with the individual. But I think the truth may be closer to home. This meaning-ful pattern was perceived by the mind, which means that the origin is in the mind, and so is the answer. Even though the experience itself is consciously perceived as an event coming from the outside (not sought out), I think still it was the work of own mind. Sometimes, the mind can be an adept trickster and perhaps it is a part in the mind which may needed to bypass the ratioontnal part of mind to bring itself into awareness. The trick is in knowing what this need is and where it comes from within the mind.



Monad:

...the collusion of events in proximity whether consciously or unconsciously striven for. It encompasses the psychological urge to knit events together into some meaningful paradigm.

In the retroactive view, denoted as hindsight, "Synchronicity" would appear as the biography of one's life up to that point. The good and the bad instead of simply fate would appear as pure Synchronicity though at that time may not be recognized as such or responded to according to its "clues". Being "out of synch" is tantamount to misery, neurosis and possibly even psychosis. Conversely, its recognition, by whatever means, could be the adjustment to re-balance the psyche.

Anyways, that's how I see it...even though there is much more to "See" on the subject of Synchronicity. It is first a quality which belongs foremost to the Cosmos itself of which human psychology is but a miniscule emanation or reflection.



Pandora:

The ideas are still being worked out, but the idea of paranoia (i.e. positive paranoia, or pronoia) caught my attention.  It has been noted that many instances of synchronicity are preceded by a charged mental state.  Sometimes I see subconscious as a program that is running silently in the background of the conscious mind.  The program is instructed to search out patterns and meaning that are relevant to the person.  I think this is a default state in an average person, and this is how a person "notices things" in his every day life.  My first theory is that the program can be inadvertently, or intentional pushed into overdrive where it continues functioning unawares to the conscious mind.  So, a person may be consciously engaged in another project with the background program is still running in overdrive.  The program is like a slot machine, always spinning and searching for a pattern that is meaningful to the person and when it eventually finds one...BINGO! It pushes its solution into conscious awareness, often taking the person, who by then probably forgot about it, by surprise.  Another way imagine it would be to see it as a pop up screen from a computer program running in the background, notifying the conscious that the scanning is complete.  Because it takes the conscious person by surprise, and because it is usually still meaningless in itself ("what does this mean?"), the person tries to tie these unrelated events together, which often leads the person to believe in fate, god or as in the case of Chinese, deterministic universe.  

But what does it really point to?  Accusal universe or the limitations/weaknesses of the human mind.  Most cultures throughout history have chosen to see synchronicity as a proof of deterministic (or semi-determinisitc) universe. To sages and spiritual masters who are said to be one with God or deterministic universe, everything around them is seen as meaningful and synchronous.   If the patterns are sought by the mind based on personal experience and meaning, what patterns is their mind seeking, and in relation to who or what?  What kind of program are they running?
I do see an interesting switch taking place when a person accepts determinism.   Another thing that is noted in the case of paranoia (both positive and negative) is that everything becomes....PERSONAL.   Events are not random and meaningless but are seen as personally tailored to the individual.   The universe may work with or against, but it is still about YOU. When an individual accepts determinism, it becomes impersonal again ("It was meant to be", "I'm just a pawn in the cosmic play", etc.).  And what is the result?  A person becomes free to roam around, without really taking the burden of considering consequences, actually making the consequences.    

For me, this raises more questions than answers:  what causes one person to experience negative paranoia and another a positive paranoia? How does meaning play into all of this, into existence, into human life, how should it?  How can one tell the difference between delusion and revelation?  Etcetera, etcetera...so many angles...



Fixed Cross:

The line of questioning suggests that one step back is all that's necessary to see the answer, or at least to create the space where it can appear. Causality is not a concept that is applicable to everything. It holds no content of meaning, it represents a homogenous quality and a lot of quantities, no difference in qualities. Paranoia, self-imaging, projection into the world - all of us are suffering from it - it is what consciousness is. Some are more attuned to their direct environment and future, others more to long distance paradigms. All of this is sensitivity to meaning, and meaning is the sensibility of self-conscious life, that around which it keeps its consciousness related to its life.

So when we experience synchronicity and wonder how the deterministic cause could be contained in the subjective meaning, we ask the wrong question. Causality simply means that stuff happens in relation to other stuff. That things aren't isolated. Ultimately, that there are no things, but only process.

The scientific myth is different from the scientific method. The method involves carefully selected processes, stuff that complies with the sort of expectations science needs to be able to have. The myth is that all things can be explained in that way. The way in which the particular viewpoint that gave rise to scientific domination took hold is well explained by without-music in the thread "The Ontological Tyranny".

In the meantime, life goes on as substances that select their interactions with each other in the terms of their survival and attainment of their values. I mean values as in a plant that needs carbon from the air and doesn't need oxygen, so it is of value to other lifeforms by  what it expels from itself. In this way, all values are relating valuers with each other, in the most contradicting and complementary ways. All of this is happening while people are trying to align electrons so that they might or might not bounce off a wall. The portions of existence that can be selected, isolated an perceived will be selected, isolated and perceived - or not -, the others will keep behaving in ways that are proper to their own, invisible ways of relating to other inscrutable forms. The universe is interconnected in literally every possible way it can be. That is only logical. Linear causality can describe the connections of events in one plane of time and one strand of environment. It can not explain a gravity field, you need a more comprehensive logic for that. It can certainly not describe a culture, you need a much more comprehensive logic for that. The way things, events, are related is not readable in terms of a linear progression of probabilistic nano events. The concept of that alone is ludicrous. What science clearly implies is that it is limited in what it can relate without breaking its own laws. In reality, when the doors of perception are cleansed, events are related simply by their relationship. Synchronicity designates a powerful relation that is significant on more than one plane. It gives the relating evens and their agents and objects more substance, quality, density. The events and their objects are pulled closer to the core of the subject. The universe is unfolding upon the subject, its folds come together in a juncture, the person is aware he, rather than any scientific definition, is the law of his own world. He who gives meaning - as you described, Pandora - the brain is selective. But not because it is defective, but because that is what brains do, filter - value in terms it can use to sustain itself and justify itself to itself - that is all it does.

When synchronicity happens, it is on the one hand the random occurrence of a meaningless coincidence, - but on whose hand? Who are we convincing? Only the assumption that by a logic that we can not possibly apply, the event will fail to make the same sort of sense as it does by the standard of experience. We can never verify if such events are not indeed rooted, causally, in the origin of their significance, that they only arrive there, randomly, perceived as significance by an opportunistic brain. We can not scientifically verify any meaning. It's rather an inverse relation - science allows us to see through meaning, to dissolve it, to see another picture than a meaningful one. But the power of science versus meaning fools almost everyone besides its creators into thinking that it also explains meaning - away. It does'n - it has still not explained the relation between thought the brain. By all accounts I trust, this is because the brain is not a builder-causer, but a filter-transmitter. Thoughts originate in the brain, but their substance - their poles and their arc, the values and their interplay - is of a non-physical nature.

Selection is the cosmic substance, synchronicity is an occasion where matter is seen as subjected to resonating a more primal process. Life, all good moments, are seen as matter subjected to selecting, when identity and choice come together, - and synchronicity is, considered in its own right, one of a human life's great stimulants.
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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Tue Jul 29, 2014 5:25 pm

Synchronicity...Echo became obsessed with the idea years ago.

Every music video and song, had a hidden message; every movie was expressing a secret code.

The brain is attracted to patterns, in the same way an organism is attracted to nutrition.
It sees them, everywhere, and then tries to integrate them into broader, cohesive, world-views.
Patterns are valuable but they can also lead a mind astray, because they represent a need - and needs can make a mind see whatever it wants to see.

A world-view must refer to phenomena - the noumenon which has more connections to the phenomenon, has more validity - it is more probable.

I believe symbols are important, within memetic contexts.
I also think their power, their relevance, remains within these memetic contexts.

A conspiracy theory can be dismissed by including it within outlandish conspiracy theories - this is also a way of hiding.

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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Sun Aug 17, 2014 11:11 am

Quote :
"Events that appear to be meaningful coincidences can often be plausibly explained simply as products of chance. Our generally poor awareness of what can and indeed is likely to occur purely by chance may be responsible for our attributing special significance to events which in reality have no such significance. Explicitly or implicitly, this strategy for explaining coincidences appeals to considerations deriving from probability theory and cognitive psychology.

The law of truly large numbers

The most important of the considerations from probability theory is what has been called ‘the law of truly large numbers’. In the words of two Harvard mathematicians, Persi Diaconis and Frederick Mosteller, this ‘law’ states that ‘with a large enough sample, any outrageous thing is likely to happen’. They continue:

The point is that truly rare events, say events that occur only once in a million . . . are bound to be plentiful in a population of 250 million people [the population of the USA]. If a coincidence occurs to one person in a million each day, then we expect 250 occurrences a day and close to 100,000 such occurrences a year.

(Diaconis and Mosteller 1989: 859)

In view of this surprising frequency, ‘we can be absolutely sure that we will see incredibly remarkable events. When such events occur, they are often noted and recorded. If they happen to us or someone we know, it is hard to escape that spooky feeling’ (ibid.).

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Normal causes

What seem to be meaningful coincidences can also be explained by demonstrating or supposing that, in spite of appearances, there is a normal causal connection between the events involved. Normal causes could create the appearance of a coincidence in various ways.

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Common source

The two events in an apparent coincidence could be causally related in that they both derive from the same source. Suppose the same unlikely image appears on the same night in the dreams of two people who have not been in contact with one another. There is no way in which the dream of one person here could be considered causally responsible for that of the other in any normal sense. However, it is possible that both dreamers were exposed to the same image the previous day, perhaps on television. This televised image would then be the probable common source of the image in both dreams.

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Undetected causal relationship

One’s inability to discern a causal connection between two events does not mean that such a connection is not there, eluding one’s present discernment.

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Cryptomnesia

One specific form of undetected causal relationship is cryptomnesia, where a memory enters consciousness but is not recognised as such. For instance, William James relates the story of a young woman in Germany who, while in a fever, was heard to utter coherent but unconnected sentences in Latin, Greek and rabbinical Hebrew, even though she was a ‘simple creature’ and had no conscious knowledge of the languages in question. Initially, no explanation could be found other than to suggest that she was possessed by a devil. Later, however, a physician traced the girl’s history and discovered that when she was nine she had been charitably taken in by an old Protestant pastor who, within the girl’s hearing, used to read aloud to himself from his books which included the Greek and Latin Fathers and a collection of rabbinical writings. Within these books were found many of the very sentences spoken by the fevered girl (James 1890: 681). In addition to this kind of anecdotal evidence, the phenomenon of cryptomnesia has been demonstrated experimentally (see Zusne and Jones 1989: 138).


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Subliminal or heightened perception

Causal relationships could go undetected if part of the information linking the events in question is absorbed subliminally or through a form of heightened perception. This effect is often similar to that of cryptomnesia: one’s conscious actions and knowledge are influenced by information one does not know one has. However, with subliminal perception it is not a case of forgetting information that has once been in consciousness but of the information never having been in one’s conscious awareness at all.

More specifically, heightened perception covers the possibility, increasingly substantiated by scientific findings, that the human organism has considerably more channels for taking in information than just the traditional five senses and, further, that even the traditional five have a vastly more extensive range and subtlety than is usually appreciated. Zusne and Jones point out, for example, that

some people . . . can literally hear what another person may be thinking. Thinking is often accompanied by muscular movements of which the thinker is not aware. The entire speech apparatus, including the tongue and the larynx, moves. Even though the movements are slight, some people are able to pick up the air vibrations produced by these movements.

(Zusne and Jones 1989: 83)

Extraordinary as this sounds, the phenomenon was clearly demonstrated in the case of a nine-year-old mentally retarded Latvian girl with apparent thought- reading abilities (ibid.: 83–4). A similar phenomenon is ‘muscle-reading’: certain people can learn to feel and interpret the involuntary muscular movements of others – and also various postural clues, changes in facial expression, eye movements, etc. – as indications of what those others are thinking (ibid.: 84–5).


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Conscious or unconscious deception

Another way in which a normal causal relationship may be responsible for creating the appearance of a coincidence is through conscious or unconscious deception somewhere along the line of transmission of the incident. That various kinds of deception can be responsible for producing events that appear to be related other than by normal physical and psychological causes is clear enough from the existence of stage magic – where the effect can be positively uncanny even though one knows full well that deception is involved.

The preceding considerations from probability theory and cognitive psychology provide ways of understanding apparent coincidences that challenge the case Jung would make for their improbability and acausality. However, none of these perspectives adequately accounts for the depth and subtlety of meaning that can attach to experiences of coincidence. It is, above all, this sense of meaningfulness that gives coincidences their fascination and that often leads those who experience them to consider them worthy of further attention.

-

The mother above all represents for the child a ‘transformational object’. The appearance and action of the mother in the child’s world usually is accompanied by some form of (mostly positive) transformation for the child: hunger is trans- formed into satiety, wetness into dryness, anxiety into security, and in general distress into relief (ibid.: 55–8 ). Faber notes the parallels between the experience of the child in this early period and the experience of synchronicity in adult life. Just as the child is inextricably connected to or merged with the mother, so the experiencer of a synchronicity seems briefly to be connected to or merged with the outer world. Just as the mother responds in a timely way to the child’s needs, so in synchronistic events the outer world seems to respond in a timely way (‘simultaneously’) to the psychic state of the experiencer." [Roderick Main, Synchronicity and Jung's Critique of Modern Western Culture]

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"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Sun Aug 17, 2014 11:12 am

Synchronicty was Jung's method of re-introducing Xt. :

Quote :
"As he admitted in a letter to H. Irminger (22 September 1944), he did aim to promote dialogue:

"I start from a positive Christianity which is as much Catholic as Protestant, and I endeavour in a scientifically responsible manner to point out those empirically graspable facts which make the justification of Christian and, in particular, Catholic dogma at least plausible, and besides that are best suited to give the scientific mind an access to understanding." (Jung 1973: 349–50)


The principal distinction throughout Jung’s mature work on religion is between religion as experience and religion as creed:

"A creed gives expression to a definite collective belief, whereas the word religion expresses a subjective relationship to certain metaphysical, extramundane factors. A creed is a confession of faith intended chiefly for the world at large and is thus an intramundane affair, while the meaning and purpose of religion lie in the relationship of the individual to God (Christianity, Judaism, Islam) or to the path of salvation and liberation (Buddhism)." (Jung 1957: par. 507)

‘Creeds are codified and dogmatized forms of original religious experience’ (ibid.: par. 10).

"The fact that the life of Christ is largely myth does absolutely nothing to disprove its factual truth – quite the contrary. I would even go so far as to say that the mythical character of a life is just what expresses its universal human validity. It is perfectly possible, psychologically, for the unconscious or an archetype to take complete possession of a man and to determine his fate down to the smallest detail. At the same time objective, non-psychic parallel phenomena can occur which also represent the archetype. It not only seems so, it simply is so, that the archetype fulfils itself not only psychically in the individual, but objectively outside the individual. My own conjecture is that Christ was such a personality." (Jung 1952a: par. 648)

The modern form of this theory originated in the work of Max Scheler, José Ortega, and Karl Mannheim.9 Homans surveys their ideas (ibid.: 175–7) and finds ‘three major interlocking features that form the core of the theory of the mass society’ (ibid.: 177). These are that ‘modern man’, first, ‘has lost contact with the past and thus is uprooted and traditionless’; second, ‘has become depersonalized – he has lost his autonomy, separateness, and distinc- tiveness’; and, third, ‘either is isolated and alienated from the social order or else is submissive to its authoritarian political and social structures’ (ibid.).

For Jung, therefore, another means of addressing the social crisis represented by mass-mindedness is to promote authentic, experientially based religion as its ‘counterbalance’. In the later sections of ‘The Undiscovered Self’ he elaborates on the role of analytical psychology as a process of self-knowledge that can lead to numinous encounters with the unconscious, ‘the only available source of religious experience’ (ibid.: par. 565). Only ‘religious experience and immediate relation to God’, he writes, can provide ‘that certainty which will keep me, as an individual, from dissolving in the crowd’ (ibid.: par. 564)." [Roderick Main, Synchronicity and Jung's Critique of Modern Western Culture]


Leading to a New-Ageist Relativization:

Quote :
". . . ‘Spirituality’ has to do with the personal; that which is interior or immanent; that which is one’s experienced relationship with the sacred; and that wisdom or knowledge which derives from such experiences. At heart, spirituality has come to mean ‘life’ . . . Life, rather than what transcends life, becomes God (thus contemporary spirituality may more precisely be termed ‘spirituality of life’)." (Heelas 2002: 358–9)

Here I will focus on some of the connections that can be found in or readily inferred from Jung’s own work. Explicitly, he appealed to synchronicity in addressing such perennial religious concerns as miracles, the possibility of surviving death, and the nature and transformation of conceptions of God. Implicitly, the theory of synchronicity also informed his thinking on mystical unity, self-realisation and the meaning of life.

Synchronicities could be accounted miracles because the meaningful acausal co-ordination of their component events seems to transgress the usual limitations of what is considered psychophysically possible (see Holland 1967; Polkinghorne 1998: 85). Jung sometimes specifically refers to synchronistic events as miracles, though it is clear that he does so only in a loose way without any expectation of having to provide theological backing for his usage (1952b: par. 848; 1976: 46, 537, 539). Moreover, he is generally quick to re-describe the putative miracle scientifically in terms of either parapsychological findings (1951b: par. 995) or the statistical character of natural law (1976: 540). Occasionally, however, he does address the issue of traditionally designated religious miracles and on these occasions sometimes refers to synchronicity. Thus, speaking of the identity of Christ the ‘empirical man’ with ‘the traditional Son of Man type’, he says: ‘Wherever such identities occur, characteristic archetypal effects appear, that is numinosity and synchronistic phenomena, hence tales of miracles are inseparable from the Christ figure’ (ibid.: 21; cf. 1952a: par. 648). At other times he invokes synchronicity to help account for miracle cures that cannot be satisfactorily explained in other ways (1976: 498–500).

Most forthrightly and grandly, Jung states that ‘[s]ince a creation without the reflecting consciousness of man has no discernible meaning, the hypothesis of a latent meaning endows man with a cosmogonic significance, a true raison d’être’ (1976: 495). The importance of synchronistic experiences here is that ‘[t]hey point to a latent meaning which is independent of consciousness’ (ibid.). In doing this, synchronistic experiences themselves point towards humanity’s cosmogonic significance and raison d’être.

Because it does so with reference to experiences rather than beliefs and dogmas, the concepts and themes are largely disembedded from traditional contexts. It becomes possible to think of miracles, mystical unity, spiritual transformation, life after death, images of God, and the meaning of life in a manner less dependent on traditional assumptions. Synchronicity thus supports the trend of the spiritual revolution towards an increasing de-traditionalisation of religion. This said, it does not necessitate de-traditionalisation, and traditional religions could readily co-opt the Jungian evidence and insights to support their own positions. However, in doing so, they would be reaching into an experiential space that is equally accessible to other religious traditions as well as to non-religious orientations – a relatively neutral ground that might be conducive to inter-religious relations and dialogues between religion and science. Providing this resource is another of the ways in which synchronicity may be able to contribute to the transformation of contemporary religion." [ib.]

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"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Sun Aug 17, 2014 11:13 am

New Age Subjectivist Progressivism...

Quote :
"New Age religion, as Hanegraaff sees it, typically consists of the following five elements: this-worldliness, holism, evolutionism, the psychologisation of religion and sacralisation of psychology, and expectations of a coming new age (1998: 514). Each of these is also an element in Jung’s outlook.

New Agers tend to locate spiritual and ethical authority within the individual self. The prominent New Age teacher Sir George Trevelyan advises his listeners: ‘Only accept what rings true to your Inner Self’ (reported in Heelas 1996: 21). Starhawk likewise emphasises ‘self-responsibility and the individual as final arbiter for the meaning and direction of life’ (York 1995: 113). Indeed, Heelas identifies ‘Self-spirituality’ as the defining and unifying feature of the New Age. ‘Self-spirituality’ involves ‘the monistic assumption that the Self itself is sacred’ (1996: 2) and an outlook where ‘[t]he “individual” serves as his or her own source of guidance’ (ibid.: 23). According to Heelas, this notion is responsible for a ‘remarkable consistency’ beneath ‘much of the heterogeneity’ of the New Age (ibid.: 2). He even proposes that ‘[t]he New Age shows what “religion” looks like when it is organised in terms of what is taken to be the authority of the Self’ (ibid.: 221).

This is not to deny that New Agers sometimes recognise other sources of authority besides the inner spiritual self – e.g., more traditional teachers and external systems of thought (ibid.: 34–5) – or that there is a strong social current within the New Age – e.g., in its association with the Green movement (York 1995: 22). However, as Heelas again summarises: ‘Overall, the New Age has become more detraditionalized; the shift in emphasis has been from cosmologies to experiences; from beliefs to spiritual technologies; from heeding Mahatmas to heeding the Self’ (1996: 67)." [Roderick Main, Synchronicity and Jung's Critique of Modern Western Culture]]

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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Sun Aug 17, 2014 11:19 am

Besides the mind's ability to pick out patterns and hold them in memory, alter connecting them in meaning, trying to find a common cause, synchronicity is a Modern phenomenon.
Living in a highly ordered system, where the illusion of free-will is accompanied with limited options, shared social, economic, and cultural reference points, most of which are rooted in the Collective Unconscious, or the historical contexts within human place themselves, means that when we live in a shared human environment - increasingly so with globalization - that our symbols, gestures, words, and the way we interpret them are ingrained, via pop-culture and education, in our psyche.

All it takes is a stimulant, a symbol, to spontaneous produce a (re)action already present in the symbol: the medium IS the message.
The mind then makes preordained connections, crossing cultures, spaces, time, and is directed towards a universal source.
Now this is not entirely false, because memes build upon genes and then appropriate other memes, supplanting them and assimilating their symbols and ideas.
So, the phenomenon is sociological.


Consider the concept of the scapegoat.
It begins as a symbolic method of discharging communal anxieties concerning the unpredictability of nature.
Men killed the goat, to get rid of the bad spirits.

Later Christianity appropriates the symbolism and turns it into a universal concept: the Devil.
The Christian scapegoat.
The devil's symbol.
The pentagram, once a symbol of nature, becomes a Satanic symbol.
Now, anytime we see the imagery the feelings rise up in us spontaneously.
It feels like an inner knowledge is being tapped, when it has been placed there, from birth.
The child sees it in art, in everyday life hears the words associated with it; in history, because Christianity has built upon older traditions, he reads about it.
It appears like some deep secret is being unraveled.
The human psyche wants it to be so, even if it is an evil secret. Better a known evil than an unknown one.
The unpredictability of nature, its indifference is given a motive, a meaning.
It can be expunged, sacrificed, assuaged, symbolically devoured.



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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Sun Aug 17, 2014 6:25 pm

An interesting topic.

I've noticed that whenever I get into a mystical state of mind, i.e., meditate regularly, research mystical topics, so on and so forth, that I notice many peculiar synchronicities, e.g., looking at the clock exactly at 9:11 on a daily basis, and other things of that nature.



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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Thu Jan 15, 2015 12:07 pm

By a Jungian apologist, but nevertheless:

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Also;

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Thu Jan 15, 2015 12:08 pm

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Thu Jan 15, 2015 12:19 pm

On a more popular, "note" we see it reflected in cRAP music:
word associations evoking sensuality, feelings, associations...repeated in a stream with no cohesion...but for the listener a received, stimulated using these shared symbols, emotional (re)action.

RAP is the artistic form of synchronicity.
Symbolic associations implying a direction but only returning back to the Rapper....He refers, using word-associations, back to himself...and the others share in this, because they all share in the same semiology.

The cRapper is free-styling when the symbols describing him and his condition stimulate in the other this same narcissistic path back towards self.
Words referring back to internal abstractions, in isolation from the world, but unified due to a shared meme which implants in each listener the same symbols and associations.

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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Thu Jan 15, 2015 12:20 pm

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Mary Magdalene as Venus/Luciferan base-3 star and the Enochian calculator
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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Thu Jan 15, 2015 12:24 pm

So, these turds, take a small part of Hellenism, a portion of its multiplicity of approaches, Pythagorian mysticism and Plato's idealism, and claim Hellenic roots, by interpreting Judeo-christian Nihilism using these Greeks.
They merge Plato/Pythagora, and Parmenides as the precursor to Plato, with Judaic Nihilism and rediscover Christianity from a Hellenic approach.

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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Thu Jan 15, 2015 12:32 pm

Satyr wrote:
On a more popular, "note" we see it reflected in cRAP music:
word associations evoking sensuality, feelings, associations...repeated in a stream with no cohesion...but for the listener a received, stimulated using these shared symbols, emotional (re)action.

RAP is the artistic form of synchronicity.
Symbolic associations implying a direction but only returning back to the Rapper....He refers, using word-associations, back to himself...and the others share in this, because they all share in the same semiology.

The cRapper is free-styling when the symbols describing him and his condition stimulate in the other this same narcissistic path back towards self.
Words referring back to internal abstractions, in isolation from the world, but unified due to a shared meme which implants in each listener the same symbols and associations.


This has a lot to do with the [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] and the Goedel's self-referential [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] 'paradox'.

Escher:

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Religious 'faith' is always there to solve such a 'paradox'...
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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Thu Jan 15, 2015 12:35 pm

The RAP/Synchronicity connection is interesting.

In cRap word associations stimulate cultural symbols, shared unconscious, from a Jungian perspective...going deep into a neurological source.
Words are strung along, as they come forth in the mind of the cRapper, reflecting his own psychological relationship to these symbols and the imagery, sensations, emotions, they produce.
All RAP is essentially about self, as in the cRapper himself, and the audience is a participant who tries to follow the narcissistic path down to where it can relate.
Because memes create a shared narrative, the imagery, sensations, associated with certain words are common.
This commonality is then understood as a universal Truth.
The participants, through the shamanic direction of the chanting cRapper, become part of a divine prayer.
The words do not matter. it does not even matter if they make sense...what matters is that they connect emotionally, sensationally....becoming one.
The direction is always sexual...money and fame having to do with sexual accessibility.
Their shared idea being fornicating, and how great that makes them.
Their lowest-common-denominator being fucking; the primal...pure pleasure with no consequences.




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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Thu Jan 15, 2015 12:38 pm

Satyr wrote:
The RAP/Synchronicity connection is interesting.

In cRap word associations stimulate cultural symbols, shared unconscious, from a Jungian perspective...going deep into a neurological source.
Words are strung along, as they come forth in the mind of the cRapper, reflecting his own psychological relationship to these symbols and the imagery, sensations, emotions, they produce.
All RAP is essentially about self, as in the cRapper himself, and the audience is a participant who tries to follow the narcissistic path down to where it can relate.
Because memes create a shared narrative, the imagery, sensations, associated with certain words are common.
This commonality is then understood as a universal Truth.
The participants, through the shamanic direction of the chanting cRapper, become part of a divine prayer.
The words do not matter. it does not even matter if they make sense...what matters is that they connect emotionally, sensationally....becoming one.
The direction is always sexual...money and fame having to do with sexual accessibility.
Their shared idea being fornicating, and how great that makes them.
Their lowest-common-denominator being fucking; the primal...pure pleasure with no consequences.  






Roderick Main called it "Cryptoamnesia"; already excerpted above in the thread as a critique of Synchronicity.

To requote:

Quote :

Cryptomnesia

One specific form of undetected causal relationship is cryptomnesia, where a memory enters consciousness but is not recognised as such. For instance, William James relates the story of a young woman in Germany who, while in a fever, was heard to utter coherent but unconnected sentences in Latin, Greek and rabbinical Hebrew, even though she was a ‘simple creature’ and had no conscious knowledge of the languages in question. Initially, no explanation could be found other than to suggest that she was possessed by a devil. Later, however, a physician traced the girl’s history and discovered that when she was nine she had been charitably taken in by an old Protestant pastor who, within the girl’s hearing, used to read aloud to himself from his books which included the Greek and Latin Fathers and a collection of rabbinical writings. Within these books were found many of the very sentences spoken by the fevered girl (James 1890: 681). In addition to this kind of anecdotal evidence, the phenomenon of cryptomnesia has been demonstrated experimentally (see Zusne and Jones 1989: 138).


-


Subliminal or heightened perception

Causal relationships could go undetected if part of the information linking the events in question is absorbed subliminally or through a form of heightened perception. This effect is often similar to that of cryptomnesia: one’s conscious actions and knowledge are influenced by information one does not know one has. However, with subliminal perception it is not a case of forgetting information that has once been in consciousness but of the information never having been in one’s conscious awareness at all.

-


Conscious or unconscious deception

Another way in which a normal causal relationship may be responsible for creating the appearance of a coincidence is through conscious or unconscious deception somewhere along the line of transmission of the incident. That various kinds of deception can be responsible for producing events that appear to be related other than by normal physical and psychological causes is clear enough from the existence of stage magic – where the effect can be positively uncanny even though one knows full well that deception is involved.

The preceding considerations from probability theory and cognitive psychology provide ways of understanding apparent coincidences that challenge the case Jung would make for their improbability and acausality. However, none of these perspectives adequately accounts for the depth and subtlety of meaning that can attach to experiences of coincidence. It is, above all, this sense of meaningfulness that gives coincidences their fascination and that often leads those who experience them to consider them worthy of further attention." [Roderick Main, Synchronicity and Jung's Critique of Modern Western Culture]
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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Thu Jan 15, 2015 12:40 pm

Satyr wrote:
Lyssa wrote:
Satyr wrote:
We have now discovered another truth, using mathematics....
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]...presumably God is an English speaker, or French.

Mind-blowing, indeed.
I would have thought he spoke Hebrew or Greek, but no the numbers show that he is, in fact, an anglophone.
Greek alphabet has 24 letters.
Don't know how many scribbles the Hebrew alphabets has.

We have mathematical evidence that the universe is built on an Anglo-Saxon/Norman mindset.
This is comforting because now I know that my prayers, although never answered, were, at least, understood by the almighty.

Though, I do have my doubts - forgive me Lord, and He may only talk in morse code....beep, beeeep, beep, beep, beep beeep....



You cannot feel shameless about it, when you have authority figures to back it up. Jung commissioned a Marie von Franz to make J.-Xt. more marketable to those suffering from indigestion with its other-worldy crudities. You could no longer sell it the way it was after enlightenment. It had to be revised - scientifi-ed, so people can feel good about never admitting what depraved hedonists they are.
They can swallow "In the Beginning was the Word" with an "intellectual conscience" now.
Christ is a 'principle', not a person, and it becomes scientific and respectable.

The Nazi fringe had a "White Christianity" thing going - Jesus as gentile version and they had the gnostic [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]. Marie von Franz is like the scientific, respectable version of Blavatsky.

One of Marie's most influential work is one called [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

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Quote :
"A third field of interest and research was about synchronicity, psyche and matter, and numbers. It seems to have been triggered by Jung, whose research had lead him to the hypothesis about the unity of the psychic and material worlds, i.e., that they are one and the same, just different manifestations. He also believed that this concept of the unus mundus could be investigated by means of researching archetypes. Due to his advanced age, he turned the problem over to von Franz. Two of her books, Number and Time and Psyche and Matter deal with this research. In 1968, von Franz was the first to argue that the mathematical structure of DNA is analogous to that of the I Ching. She cited the I Ching in an essay, Symbols of the Unus Mundus, published in her book Psyche and Matter.

How collective unconscious compensates the one-sidedness of Christianity – this was a basic concern throughout many of her works, not only about fairytales and alchemy, which often compensate or complete the ruling god image of Christianity: In an analysis of the visions of Saint Perpetua, a martyr she writes, that those visions enable us to gain a deep insight into the unconscious spiritual situation of the time. They show the deep conflict of that time, the transition from Paganism to Christianity. “The martyrs appear in many respect as the tragic, unconscious victims of the transformation which was then being fulfilled deep down in the collective stratum of the human soul: the transformation of the image of God“."

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Most of it is Plato and Pythagoras rehashed with J.-Xt.
Egyptian Hieroglyphics were the impetus behind Hebraic mysticism. Persecution played a large part in "hiding the name of the God - YHVH" through numbers and number-relations.
Later this became literalized as the Kabala.

I'm yet to read this:
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Mathematical patterns tend to yield harmony and structure and deep meanings. They shed light on the web of relations. But its something else, like a weakling's dishonesty, to claim that as reality in itself.
In Pythagorean times, and even to Indo-Germanic people, the "cosmos" was Not reality, but the ordered universe and so Pythagoras could reasonable say the "cosmos" has a metre and a musical harmony.
The Indo-Germanics could say chanting and metres "held" the universe.  Sacred vs. Profane was a dimension and a guarded border.

But these biblical slaves merge the poetic cosmos as reality itself.
Whatever.


A case of ordering, static noumenon, and the fluctuating producing disordering, phenomenon.
Of course it has a logic...it is based on an organic process.
Ordering is this self-referential logic....based on the on/off, binary 1/0 neuro-processing method.
It reflects the living organism's self-organizing, within a entropic reality.
Man projects his own functions outwards, and see them reflected back.

Such an organism can only make sense of patterns reflecting what is most intimate to it: its own on/off neurological method.
Beginning as a good/no-good discrimination.
Multiplicity reduced to some-thing/no-thing... where THING is the Lord, God, the UNI-verse....the complete verse.
Once reduced to that all the incomprehensible things are excuses as infinity, evil, the paradox, the complex, and for the Alexandrian minded secular humanist version of the Judeo-Christian nihilistic psychology, the "yet to be known" and/or the "yet to be deciphered, suing the universal code"."

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[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] explains this really beautifully.
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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity Mon Oct 10, 2016 7:00 am

Nicholas Cusa's influence on Jung's Synchronicity:

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"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

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PostSubject: Re: Synchronicity

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Synchronicity
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Know Thyself :: AGORA-
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