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Recidivist

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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyFri Aug 15, 2014 3:17 pm

Satyr wrote:
See SupderString Theory and Quantum mechanics to see the dead-end Physics has reached.

This is indeed correct.
Science is vanishing up it's own derriere.

One of the most damning observations to be made is this: if science and technology are heading towards some kind of absolute, technological singularity - as the liberal technocrats, who treat it as a surrogate Christianity suggest - and where all things become possible... where are the time travelers?

Why are they not flocking backwards in time in time traveling tourist buses to meet the Christ and other such great historical figures, to meet the apes at the dawn of mankind, buy photos and souvenirs, and tell us of the amazing world to come where all ills are cured and life goes on forever?

The excuses are many and involve nonsense such as parallel universes and worm holes, for which there is not a shred of physical evidence whatsoever.

The truth is dark and frightening to the childish liberal mind.
There aren't any time travelers because despite the billions of years left for the stars to burn it never becomes possible to travel backwards through time.

Their precious singularity is only a myth, as every religion has its myths and claim that entropy is a merely an illusion, and heaven is just around the corner for those that believe.

A hard limit to human achievements that we can see from this point in time.



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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyFri Aug 15, 2014 3:17 pm

This is or ought to be a philosophy forum.

Metaphysicians, who're free to draw from observations scientists, or more specifically, researchers have made, may have a superior conceptualization of things than theoretical physicists, and their work can be just as technical as theoretical physicists.

However, there is such a thing as being unnecessarily technical and esoteric. If a scientist hands me something too convoluted for me to comprehend, not cause I'm stupid, but because I lack the time/energy to learn his language, which would take anyone years to learn, and says to me, accept my conclusions, I say fuck him, how do I know it's not full of holes, or that he doesn't have an agenda? If he can't explain it to me in words, terms and mathematics I can understand, I'm not just going to accept it, I say explain it to me in a way I can understand and connect it with a ton of research, preferably from multiple/independent sources and/or everyday experience, and if you can't, I'm going to go with whatever makes sense to me, independently of him and his kind, because his language is noise to me, and I suspect they use such languages to disguise how very mundane what they have to say is.

Some goof said "science is nothing more than the refinement of everyday thinking". Well, what're we doing here? I won't have faith in anyone, you've got to prove it to me, or I'll go with nothing, or whatever I or someone else comes up with that I can understand and verify.

Additionally, it's about values, some shit I'm just not interested in, and there's always elements of the subjective in the objective, our cognition differs, and intuitions and experiences play a role, more/less, in any devising of a theory and testing of a hypothesis, which is why humanity, scientists or whoever, will never be able to reach 100% consensus on anything. What I'm talking about is being a free thinker, free thinking precedes science for me, and is something more akin to philosophy, and it is to that, which real rationalists and individualists, turn to.

Science, no institution, should have a monopoly on thought, and even within science, there's plenty of competing theories on just about everything, but weaker minds always go with the highest POWER, which they cannot fathom, but are drawn to it like moths to a flame.
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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyFri Aug 15, 2014 3:25 pm

Divergense wrote:
This is or ought to be a philosophy forum.

Metaphysicians, who're free to draw from observations scientists, or more specifically, researchers have made, may have a superior conceptualization of things than theoretical physicists, and their work can be just as technical as theoretical physicists.

Draw observations from, absolutely. Misinterpret it and derive from that misinterpretation a theory that is not coinciding with observable physical evidence... no.
Everything needs to trace back to phenomena.
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Satyr
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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyFri Aug 15, 2014 3:36 pm

phoneee wrote:
A bible of physical observable evidence, measured, calculated, reproduceable, scrutinized and peer reviewed, and open to be contested by anyone who wishes to provide evidence of otherwise.

As noted [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.], the final word has not been written nor will it ever be written.
I leave that to your ilk....starting with you, and the bovine-boy.

Anyone, at any time, who claims to have discovered a theory to explain "EVERYTHING" will have gotten past the cynical radar of a stupid cunt, like you, who seems to have a soft spot for official doctrine.
Shall I speculate as to why that is?

Your "cynicism" seems to be selective.
If it is about an individual, then you are skeptical, and demeaning, like a good cunt, but when it's the official, community, belief, then your skepticism - which is what cynicism is, at the end - is on stand-by...you being a good cunt, to the end.
A cunt is , after all, a gateway, to official doctrine - a filtering device.

What that makes you, other than a coward and a hypocrite, and a typical woman, despite the "hungry spider-like bullshit you seduce bovines with, is another fuckin' woman, or an effete man-child....another cunt.
Every age has had them, and every age will forever have them as its majority.
Modern is a word meaning whatever is most current. The majority has always been current, you dumb cunt, and you are but another member of this throng.

You are the ones cheering as Bruno was burned, because it's was peer-reviewed dogma that he was guilty of not abiding by the official narrative.
You seem to think per-review is a scientific invention...being the dumb cunt that you are.


phoneee wrote:
Not a perfect system, but it works well and beats any other by a long, long shot. Evidence: the computer you're using right now, combustion engines, the fact you don't freeze to death living in Canada, et cetera ad nauseum.

Nobody questioned the usefulness of numbers...which is not the same as using them to extrapolate universal theories that encompass all for all-time.
Not unless you produce a device, a creation, which is eternal.

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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyFri Aug 15, 2014 3:42 pm

Let me say it again very slowly:

I... don't... care... about... your... opinion... of... me.

You attempt to discredit me on bias is a waste of time.

I will not address anything that isn't directly related to the OP.
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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyFri Aug 15, 2014 3:44 pm

phono wrote:
One specific state of order and one specific state of disorder have the exact same probability.
Two systems with the exact same order can have different entropy quotients.
Am I speaking a foreign language?

Perfect diamonds are very rare. The more perfect its level of order the rarer they are.
Not all states of order are all equally probable - this should be immediately obvious for someone observing reality first, before coming to such conclusions.

You jumped immediately to the conclusion you wanted to be true. (and then call it mainstream science...well, maybe it has become popular science but I think not mainstream science, yet)

The reason why not all states are equally probable has to do with probability, well duh. One has to look at every single step which is taking place in a process.
Let's bring this to your most desired area of expertise, your background. Patterns in genetics don't drop from the sky. Not all results are possible when two people mix. If one desire to establish certain traits, then it takes repeated mixing to purify a pattern. And at the same time the desired genetic pattern is under pressure through mutations which produce errors in a pattern.
Like trying to get out the last few dust particles when cleaning a room. Exponentially rising in difficulty as fewer dust particles are left over.

In reality not all states are equally probable.
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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyFri Aug 15, 2014 3:47 pm

Belief in creation can be based on the two thermodynamic laws of nature, the two most basic laws in the the entire science realm. The first law states that energy is conserved or constant at all times. Energy, in whichever of its many forms, absolutely can be neither created nor destroyed. This rule ensures a dependable and predictable universe, whether for stars or for human life.

The second basic law of nature also involves energy. It describes unavoidable losses in any process whatsoever which involves the transfer of energy. The energy does not disappear but some always becomes unavailable, often as unusable heat. In other words, everything deteriorates, breaks down and becomes less ordered with time. Ultimately death itself is a consequence of the second law of thermodynamics.

Energy conservation implies that the universe did not start up by itself. Energy decay further implies that this universe cannot last forever. Secular science has no satisfactory explanation for such laws of nature. Instead, these laws are entirely consistent with the biblical creation.
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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyFri Aug 15, 2014 3:53 pm

What I'm about to write, I'm not writing for anyone in particular:
A ton of inventions have had nothing to do science with.
Science is young, invention is old hat.
Look at the relatively unscientific social and technological revolution occurring in Babylon circa 3000-2500 BC, if I remember correctly.
The Wright brothers learned to fly precisely by disregarding the science of their day (which was unhelpful and discouraging), and DIYing it.
Many new species have been discovered, species science told us were extinct, or never existed, so don't bother looking for them, like the panda bear.
And look at all the blunders science and inventions derived thereof, have made, look what they've done to the earth in the name of "progress".
The point is, I'm not saying don't consider the science, consider it, but don't be bound by it, chained to it, slavishly, unless, that's your nature, irrevocably.
I say don't be afraid to DIY thought, or what are we here for???


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Satyr
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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyFri Aug 15, 2014 3:53 pm

Recidivist wrote:
Satyr wrote:
See SupderString Theory and Quantum mechanics to see the dead-end Physics has reached.

This is indeed correct.
Science is vanishing up it's own derriere.

One of the most damning observations to be made is this: if science and technology are heading towards some kind of absolute, technological singularity - as the liberal technocrats, who treat it as a surrogate Christianity suggest - and where all things become possible... where are the time travelers?

Why are they not flocking backwards in time in time traveling tourist buses to meet the Christ and other such great historical figures, to meet the apes at the dawn of mankind, buy photos and souvenirs, and tell us of the amazing world to come where all ills are cured and life goes on forever?

The excuses are many and involve nonsense such as parallel universes and worm holes, for which there is not a shred of physical evidence whatsoever.

The truth is dark and frightening to the childish liberal mind.
There aren't any time travelers because despite the billions of years left for the stars to burn it never becomes possible to travel backwards through time.

Their precious singularity is only a myth, as every religion has its myths and claim that entropy is a merely an illusion, and heaven is just around the corner for those that believe.

A hard limit to human achievements that we can see from this point in time.



It's reducible to this:

When God, as a concept was dead, for most who could not abide by such superstitious, drivel, given the increasing data, then the Sartrean horror of freedom was reached....the Nietzschean resentiment.
The masses chose to latch unto a different absolute, with its own priesthood (experts, and absolutes).
God was turned to a number, a word....ergo "the word was God" and/or the :"word of God".
The perfection, absoluteness omniscient/omnipotence of the concept God, became abstracted into a word (most often LOVE), a number ONE.
There is no "one" outside the human skull, nor any "love" as it is defined by the secular humanists as this form of purified, Platonic idea(l)...but has this prevented cunts, like the "cynical" phoneee to detach from the words?
Nope.
Words is all she has when god is dead.

Words are malleable, so they can mean anything ...ergo cynicism.
but, at the same time, words are defines in the dictionary or in scientific text, aquiring an authority...ergo the cunt phoneee's schizophrenia.
She is cynical (skeptical, in the cold objective sense) only when it comes to unofficial opinions - once it is made official it is religious dogma which she repeats as a biblical scholar repeats scripture.

She questions the mortal man's ideas, but when it comes to the community doctrine then she's no longer a cynic, but another dumb cunt.
See filtering at work there?
Her doubts are meant to test the mortal, everyday man, which she places into a uniform box....but when it comes to the institutional decree, then she; one more stupid woman, repeating, referring, deferring, bending her back and raising her arse to receive the official member's words....
Typical, simple, dumb as shit...

The only use she has of a biological male is as a penis and as an emotional depository.
Her alpha remains fixed.

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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyFri Aug 15, 2014 4:02 pm

Except that in science there are no absolute theories, and contesting is part of the method.
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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyFri Aug 15, 2014 4:04 pm

Excellent, you dumb cunt...and so you repeating an other's theories is you regurgitating a hypothetical.
Isn't it?
It's not even yours.
It's you, repeating what you've surrendered to, being the cunt that you are, and parroting it as if it were something final, definite...the end...as in pleasure as an end.


Tell me...are you a hedonist?

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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyFri Aug 15, 2014 4:09 pm

A hypothetical which is pertinent to the subject being discussed should be digested by those discussing it.
Digested.
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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyFri Aug 15, 2014 4:12 pm

phoneee wrote:
A hypothetical which is pertinent to the subject being discussed should be digested by those discussing it.
Digested.

Are you a conduit to internet data which nobody can access, or another cunt which is only good for blowing Satyr and then shutting her mouth?

So, like mooo, your bovine -boy, you are now not a Hedonist?
What about next month?
Will you be a Communist, then, or a Capitalist, a racist....or an egalitarian?
What do cunts, like you do, day by day?
Teach me.

Pleasure IS the end....you go where pleasure leads.  
How about I fuck you up the ass, Greek-style, and then cry later, for that emotional kick?

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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyFri Aug 15, 2014 5:36 pm

Satyr wrote:
Recidivist wrote:
Phoneutria wants to encourage interracial breeding, as a way of removing harmful mutations. But this says nothing about the other qualities of the organism that will be affected.
Says a lot though about what she is afraid of and what lengths she'll go to to placate it.

In Moderns the schizo-narcissism comes forth in a patting one's self on the back.
Ask her how much of a mutt she is.
Brazilian style race-mixing: the future of man is off-white, beige....

Excelling at kicking an inflated sack around and nothing else.
A state of functional mediocrity, sometimes rising to the above-average, when more Portuguese and Spanish blood is mixed in; a talent for the rhythms of words, and psycho-dancing, but nothing more there.

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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyFri Aug 15, 2014 5:46 pm

Hrodebert wrote:
Satyr wrote:
Recidivist wrote:
Phoneutria wants to encourage interracial breeding, as a way of removing harmful mutations. But this says nothing about the other qualities of the organism that will be affected.
Says a lot though about what she is afraid of and what lengths she'll go to to placate it.

In Moderns the schizo-narcissism comes forth in a patting one's self on the back.
Ask her how much of a mutt she is.
Brazilian style race-mixing: the future of man is off-white, beige....

Excelling at kicking an inflated sack around and nothing else.
A state of functional mediocrity, sometimes rising to the above-average, when more Portuguese and Spanish blood is mixed in; a talent for the rhythms of words, and psycho-dancing, but nothing more there.

The point is?

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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyFri Aug 15, 2014 5:49 pm

The point is...that a mutt would never say that being a mixed-breed is a negative.

Ask a border collie if it wants to be mixed with a boxer, if it knew what intelligence is.
Would it want its blood to be diluted by a dumber breed?

Ask a boxer/border collie mix if being mixed is good or bad.

You expect a mixed breed Brazilian, all becoming this curly haired beige, will tell you being mixed is a dilution of European blood resulting in a dumbing-down?
She'll find something positive about it: rhythms, chocolate skin, dancing....football skills.....whatever.
Anything to compensate for the loss of creativity, intelligence, imagination, that took centuries to evolve in more challenging conditions, resulting in Portuguese and Spanish colonialism.


The lowest-common-denominator will be protected,a s it is the binding one and the weakest part of the whole - cult of victims.
In this case the aboriginal and Negro blood is to be defended.

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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyFri Aug 15, 2014 5:51 pm

Be sure to find one not suffering from hip dysplasia before you ask.
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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyFri Aug 15, 2014 5:56 pm

phoneutria wrote:
Be sure to find one not suffering from hip dysplasia before you ask.

Given my value standards I would rather be an intelligent head in a vat than a monkey jumping around on trees.
But you have your values that give you pleasure, and I have mine.

So, go back to the trees, and hoot and holler like a good chimp, googling whatever they tell you is "good", and fuck off.

No wait, you dumb cunt...did you think your presence was indispensable?
If you are not going to blow me...what use would I have for you?
Varda?
HA!!!!
Another boring cunt with an internet account.

Go to ILP where the "nice catch" can woo you, with satyrial splendors.

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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyFri Aug 15, 2014 6:04 pm

phoneutria wrote:
Recidivist wrote:
Entropy is still so closely related with order and disorder that it suits our purposes to continue using the term as well as providing a larger context in which evolutionary events take place against a cosmic background.


If it suits you to be incorrect, I am not about to stop you.
I'll simply disregard everything you say.
Welcome to the fringe.

Blacks used to be on the fringe, remember?
A much more distant fringe than one occupied by a few contemporary white males who have their own interpretation of a physical theory.

And look where they are now.
I wonder what would happen to them if they stopped towing the liberal line.
After all, they didn't declare themselves to be human, or if they ever did no one was listening, certainly no one in authority.

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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptySat Aug 16, 2014 2:48 am

Recidivist wrote:
Hrodebert wrote:
Satyr wrote:
Recidivist wrote:
Phoneutria wants to encourage interracial breeding, as a way of removing harmful mutations. But this says nothing about the other qualities of the organism that will be affected.
Says a lot though about what she is afraid of and what lengths she'll go to to placate it.

In Moderns the schizo-narcissism comes forth in a patting one's self on the back.
Ask her how much of a mutt she is.
Brazilian style race-mixing: the future of man is off-white, beige....

Excelling at kicking an inflated sack around and nothing else.
A state of functional mediocrity, sometimes rising to the above-average, when more Portuguese and Spanish blood is mixed in; a talent for the rhythms of words, and psycho-dancing, but nothing more there.

The point is?

Motives, standpoints, a better understanding of her personality.
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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptySat Aug 16, 2014 2:54 am

Is this the first female Brazilian with whom you've had the fortunate opportunity of encountering/interacting?
She's not so unique/exclusive in this general regard: Brazilian women have a tendency to be immensely immature/cursory/liberal and louco.
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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptySun Aug 17, 2014 10:14 am

Quote :
Lyssa wrote:
Didn't Nietzsche, Foucault or Baudrillard or Bernays argue the sophisticated kind of slavery is letting the slaves think they are free?
To think that subtle coercions are not tending towards [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] and [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] exposes the success of that sophistication.

Even forgetting that, lets assume free-will trumps all memetic warfare,,,don't DNA replications depend on nourishment and can't we see the perversion that HAS already occured in food-crop manipulation? As if, even assuming the copying mechanism works to the dot and there are no increasing structural damages, the Quality of information loss can be prevented when the food chain is being tampered with? We are what we eat.
And new infections and diseases and new vaccines/meds. entering the body dont make a difference to info. entropy?

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Richard Lynn is a psychologist.
I am more inclined to indulge the genetic theories of molecular biologists.



Quote :
"Muller was one of the first scientists to take an interest in deleterious mutations. His principal interest was the mutation load in human populations, a topic that has received renewed interest. CROW (1997) has argued that we need to be aware that modern medicine and improved sanitation may have important impacts on our genetic legacy. As natural selection is relaxed, some populations will accumulate deleterious mutations, leading to a greater dependence on medicine, ultimately putting our population at risk if the ability to sustain high-level health care and sanitation is reduced. We know that humans have a high deleterious mutation rate, but the consequences of relaxing natural selection in contemporary populations will depend on the distribution of fitness effects of new mutations, and we currently lack information from an appropriate model. By assuming Mukai’s estimate of the average selective effect of deleterious mutations in Drosophila, CROW (1997) and LYNCH et al. (1999b) have argued that human populations may suffer significant genetic degradation within a short period of time. However, if there is variation among selective effects, as seems likely given the contrasting MA and molecular estimates of U in E. coli, then the average selective effect is a gross overestimate, as is our likely genetic degradation. How humans and related species evade the effects of mutation load on an evolutionary time scale is also an open question."

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Quote :
"2007: Leading geneticist [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] says human evolution is over

Human evolution is grinding to a halt because of a shortage of older fathers in the West, according to a leading genetics expert.

Fathers over the age of 35 are more likely to pass on mutations, according to Professor Steve Jones, of University College London.

Speaking today at a UCL lecture entitled “Human evolution is over” Professor Jones will argue that there were three components to evolution – natural selection, mutation and random change. “Quite unexpectedly, we have dropped the human mutation rate because of a change in reproductive patterns,” Professor Jones told The Times.

“Human social change often changes our genetic future,” he said, citing marriage patterns and contraception as examples. Although chemicals and radioactive pollution could alter genetics, one of the most important mutation triggers is advanced age in men.

This is because cell divisions in males increase with age. “Every time there is a cell division, there is a chance of a mistake, a mutation, an error,” he said. “For a 29-year old father [the mean age of reproduction in the West] there are around 300 divisions between the sperm that made him and the one he passes on – each one with an opportunity to make mistakes.

“For a 50-year-old father, the figure is well over a thousand. A drop in the number of older fathers will thus have a major effect on the rate of mutation.”

Professor Jones added: “In the old days, you would find one powerful man having hundreds of children.” He cites the fecund Moulay Ismail of Morocco, who died in the 18th century, and is reputed to have fathered 888 children. To achieve this feat, Ismail is thought to have copulated with an average of about 1.2 women a day over 60 years."

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Quote :
"British scientific researchers demonstrated that genetically modified DNA from crops can find its way into human gut bacteria, raising possible health concerns. This is because antibiotic-resistant marker genes are inserted with GM material, which could cause a person to be resistant to antibiotic medicines.

The study was conducted at Newcastle University on seven human volunteers who, in the past, had their lower intestine removed and now use colostomy bags. After eating a burger containing GM soy, researchers compared their stools with 12 people with normal stomachs. They found "to their surprise" that "a relatively large proportion of genetically modified DNA survived the passage through the small bowel." None was found in people who had complete stomachs. To see if GM DNA might be be transferred via bacteria to the intestine, they also took bacteria from stools in the colostomy bags and cultivated them. In three of the seven samples they found bacteria had taken up the herbicide-resistant gene from the GM food at a very low level.

Michael Antonio, a senior lecturer in molecular genetics at King`s College Medical School, London, said that the work was significant because the researchers demonstrated that you can get GM plant DNA in the gut bacteria, which was previously considered to be not possible. Antonio said the research suggests that antibiotic marker genes could spread around the stomach and compromise antibiotic resistance. If this were to happen, a person could be immune to beneficial antiobiotic medicines.

Marker genes are inserted into GM plants to allow identification of GM cells or tissue during development. The House of Lords has called for them to be phased out as swiftly as possible. The research was conducted at the request of the UK's Food Standards Agency, which released a statement saying the research, "concluded that the likelihood of functioning DNA being taken up by bacteria in the human or animal gut is extremely low."

Source: The Guardian
(August 2002)"

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Reality case-study:

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I believe I've already quoted this; the idea that two areas of science - being a professor of Psychology "cannot" have credibility to inform about realistic trends as an experise of molecular biology or biomed. and that kind of separation of sciences is an example of one more Dysgenic trend:

Satyr wrote:
"Idiot Savants.

A byproduct of increasing specialization.
An individual becomes an "expert" in one field, knowing all there is to know about it (a collector of information he accepts from the "appropriate" sources and regurgitates as a matter of fact); his entire life is taken over, with brief breaks to replenish his energies and to recreate, with keeping up to date with the information he requires to maintain his expert status.

As a consequence his performances in all other areas and his knowledge of any other field of knowledge, suffer.
He increasingly becomes dependent upon other experts in other fields, in this way also reinforcing his own status as a specialist they too depend upon.
This increasing interdependence results in the opposite of freedom and uniqueness. His inadequacies in all areas except the area of his expertise makes him more dependent on imitating and simply accepting popular trends or fashions coming from other "specialists"...
The source leads to a uniformity because it is itself trained by an institution wanting to produce a particular mindset and to reinforce the value of a particular behavior and a particular way of thinking. The institution, after all, wishes to preserve its own relevance and so it both promotes an attitude which does so and it also glorifies those who adhere to its principles.

As a side-effect these individuals become less and less able to perceive any grand picture or to challenge the status quo. Their entire intellectual capacity is taken over with the finer details of their craft, submerging themselves in the particular, loosing view of the universal."



Quote :
I've got the world wide web at my fingertips and a background in biomedical engineering/microbiology research.


Proof of Credentials? Papers? Dissertations? Theses?

Lets start with that paper on 'Scientific Objectivity', how about?

_________________
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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyWed Aug 20, 2014 7:09 pm

The phony claim made was that all states, all combinations are equally probable.

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There are several ways how to approach this - One would be to acknowledge that the particles are not individualized. There are green ones and purple ones but each of the green ones are essentially the same and are indistinguishable which means that they are to be treated as indistinguishable when trying to calculate the probabilities of all combinations, which in turn renders combinations which are close to evenly mixed much more probable than combinations where the colors are clustered in respective spheres.

Another approach, more visual, is to treat the process of particles moving from one sphere to the other as a step by step process (the calculated probabilities are the same).

Let's try this more visual approach of why not all states are equally probable.

Two cases.

Case 1 - The spheres are evenly mixed, well shuffled, and there are about as many purple ones as there are green ones in each of the respective spheres.
Now, one particle is moving from the left sphere to the right sphere. There is about an even chance that the particle which is moving is either purple or green because there is an equal amount of them in the left sphere.

Case 2 - The green and purple particles are very well separated from each other in their respective spheres. The left sphere is full of mainly green particles and the right one is filled mainly with purple ones.
Now a particle from the left sphere is moving to the right sphere and with an overwhelming probability it's going to be a green particle. And vice versa, if a particle is moving from the right sphere to the left one it's most likely going to be a purple one.

It should be obvious that Case 2 is unstable and is moving towards becoming Case 1 which is a comparably stable state. Case 1 may have been Case 2 in the past, at some point but the opposite move, from 1 to 2, is exceedingly unlikely when the number of particles is big enough.

Stability vs Instability

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Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 Empty
PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyThu Aug 21, 2014 4:00 pm

My claim that all states are equally probable refers to the state of entropic equilibrium alone.
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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyMon Aug 25, 2014 5:07 pm

phono wrote:
My claim that all states are equally probable refers to the state of entropic equilibrium alone.

Suit yourself.
It shows that order and disorder are not equally probable.
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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyMon Aug 25, 2014 5:07 pm

To take the messing up a room example -
Messing up a room randomly and expecting to find all the socks on one pile and the shirts on another, with the cups in the cupboard being just as probable as any other of the countless random distributions is false.

One approach how to qualitatively explain the difference is to look at the arranging of items in a sequential order, like a process.

We put the first item randomly somewhere in the room. It happens to be a pair of socks. It can be placed randomly within the room. The next item happens to be a shirt. To arrange the shirt distinctively from the socks we have to put it anywhere in the room except too close to the first pair of socks. So already in this second step there is a small probability that the arranging in distinctive piles pattern will be broken. The more items are to be arranged this way, the higher the probability that the pattern will be broken.

This restrictiveness is order.
Order is when not anything goes.

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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyMon Aug 25, 2014 5:15 pm

Anfang wrote:
phono wrote:
My claim that all states are equally probable refers to the state of entropic equilibrium alone.

Suit yourself.
It shows that order and disorder are not equally probable.

I've made no such claim.
I said that [in a state of entropic equilibrium] any one specific orderly state is equally probable to any one specific disorderly state.
The universe has nothing against order itself. It is just that there are more ways in which something can be disorderly, and thus disorder is more probable.
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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyMon Aug 25, 2014 6:32 pm

Disorder is produced by (inter)activity.
Interactivity expands in possibility (space) expanding complexity and randomness.

More patterns, more complex interactions.
No patterns, no order in the interaction - unpredictable, imperceptible; darkness is how the human brain interprets this absence.

Randomness being energies with no stable state - no pattern that would produce order long enough, in relation to man, to become perceived by man.

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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyThu Aug 28, 2014 12:05 pm

Lyssa,

Found some stuff on Prof. Steve Jones' proposal. I haven't watched or read any of this, but I am posting here so we can both look at it later. I can't right now.

Full lecture:
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Criticism:
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PostSubject: Re: Thermodynamics and Entropy Thermodynamics and Entropy - Page 7 EmptyFri Sep 05, 2014 12:57 pm

Just putting stuff here so I can read it later.

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