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Satyr
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PostSubject: Re: Spinoza Thu Jun 09, 2016 4:31 pm

Slaughtz wrote:
A nihilist may flip meanings to opposites easily, whenever it wants. To declare something exists, they may say it exists in their mind or that it exists out in the world. An "idea" becomes both a physical manifestation/interaction and one that is completely separate from the world - Descartes' "idea".

It's all in your head.

You just don't get it Slaughtz, Value Ontology is magic. It is here, there everywhere - quicksilver, it is and it is not.
It can be anything, at any time, for any one...it is perspectivism pushed to its limit, its absolute.
Not even he can explain it, like Jesus, you have to let him into your heart for him to make sense.
He refuses to because that would limit the way some other chooses to accept the "philosophy".
it is meant to seduce, all, be universal.

It is substance, but not exactly, like love, but that word is taken, like will, but let us distance ourselves from that word because value encompasses and surpasses it.... it is "type" but that would be too simple for such a mystical word.
The word gathers the worthy, the chosen, the clan.
Each understanding it in his/her own way.

It is value-selfing, when you like him, and not that, when you criticize.
It's all about you, the self, see.
If you have the right stuff... like Muslims who accuse those that reject Allah of having no soul, deserving not the glory of eternal life.
You have to feeeel it in your heart, surrender to it, like the bitches he prefers.
The more positive your attitude the closer you get - negativity distances value from you.
Accept it, and it makes sense, it is clear, reject it and you are unworthy, you just cannot understand.
It's a mind-trap.

It's this and its that, depending on the attack, the motive.

If this exposes the mind, then it is not this, it is that again.
It is an idea before its time - to be fully understood hundreds of years from now, when greater minds evolve - then his genius will be fully appreciated.
it is power but also vulnerability, love but also hate...it is whatever self it is, at any given time - self-valuing.
It is whatever self says it is.

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PostSubject: Re: Spinoza Thu Jun 09, 2016 4:51 pm

If you deny the God, you are unworthy, not ready, not adequate, for the reception of the gift.

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Slaughtz



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PostSubject: Re: Spinoza Thu Jun 09, 2016 4:54 pm

Black Panther wrote:
Quote :
VO says, "judge not", everthing is valuable in its own right...

Prrrfl.

VO says the precise opposite. We can not exist wihtout judging.

Can the world exist without judging? Or is there some grand judge watching over all reality? A secular Berkeley, where all are their own God and the prophet will guide their judgment. If not willingly, then perhaps through emotional manipulation and appeal - gossip, posturing and vanity.

Which came first: the meme or the gene? Chicken or the egg?

Did the chicken get hit with radioactive material and suddenly begin laying eggs? Falling from grace, mistakes like we are from God or Adam/Eve. Losing purity through sinful radioactive sludge.
Or did the egg, in the more vulnerable state, mutate and become a mutated creature? ( [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] )

Does a human invent new memes without reference to any other or do they mutate/combine some memes with other memes?

Is denying reality - not accepting it as inevitable and static - a means to an end or an end in itself?
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PostSubject: Re: Spinoza Thu Jun 09, 2016 4:55 pm

I'm just not worthy of His grace.

But it is all my choice - I could have opened up and saw its magic. Why would I ruin such an opportunity?

Obviously heretical.
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PostSubject: Re: Spinoza Thu Jun 09, 2016 6:16 pm

I thought I would skip repeating myself, but for the record… again...


Black Panther wrote:
Quote :
VO says, "judge not", everthing is valuable in its own right...

Prrrfl.

VO says the precise opposite. We can not exist wihtout judging.


1.

FC wrote:
"The point is that there is always a victor among the drives. The victor is not permanent and certainly not a-priori in the Kantian sense. But it is rather a logical causal proposition. If there is no victor, then there is no hierarchy, then there is no form, then there is no being."


But because of relative persistence, Anything could be said to be a victor at some point; any arrangement could be a victory in itself simply for holding itself together and this says nothing. Sure there is conatal selection at the local level, cohering into an entity, but Not every ordering is a 'positive' order. If bacteria have persisted more than others, does it mean their self-valuing is the highest? and tied to what ideal? - persisting for persisting's sake?!

This is where point 2. comes in, where be…ing is already declared a victory:

2.

FC wrote:
"Objectivity is an accomplishment - a form of focus. It is never a given standard from which the world is poured into 'the honest observer' who has 'cleaned his temple to receive' --- unless we regard this cleaning the temple as a preparing the temple, in which case, it is exactly that -- if the mind is prepared for a certain type of truth-value, it is likely to be flooded by it. So my perimeter of truth value is simply my self-valuing -- I can only decide if something is positively true or not if I relate to it strongly. This is 'unfortunately' the truth of my truthfulness - the most truthful thing I can do is accept and affirm this.And if I do, I already know that whatever it is that is perceived to be true is so in correspondence with my overall value-grid, with my world-model, which I accept to have 'created' by being an entity with a consciousness of itself as standing within a greater half-known. I understand that this entity has to be, in the final instance, the criterium. This is my ultimate 'faith' (GS) - it is the least intrusive and selective faith that I can muster - the faith in my own positive existence as standard. If I lose this faith, I lose sight of my own role in my judgments, and the question of knowledge becomes an arbitrary broken thing on the side of the road."

Truth value


If every potential-possibility is already valuable, and every being already a victory, just for be…ing, then anything and everything becomes valuable. The conception of value becomes meaningless.

Jesus had called for believers, and by your own admission, VOt is just a tool to transplant that voice from within than without, whereby the believers would come to recognize each other and come together not by a pope or a dogma or a scripture, but simply having prevailed on their terms.
No matter the criterion of e-valuating those terms of existence. "Judge not, for diversity in itself is already valuable"...

And more recently, was the equation from you: Creativity = Courage.
In other words, creative-spirits coming together is already life-enhancing; to ask for a value-standard to guage creativity is impossible, and even oppressive, for everything must simply be judged in its own light and right; its being such and such is already invaluable in itself - the sanctity of a monadological plurality.
By this token, any grp. of insane scientists creating from 'their' excess that cannot be judged from any objective view point, or any grp. of those black square minimalist artists or latrine-installation geniuses who can only be judged in their own light… would end up promoting nihilistic anarchy than health, for when everything is to be judged only in its own light, then all is valuable and that is a religion.

Try to calmly take in the implications without feeling threatened, of coming apart - if you can afford. But I doubt it.
Too bad, your spirit lacks the courage for mental sincerity and overall hygiene, mindf---ed as it, by jesus and plotinus and a host of others.

As regards Satyr, whatever be his approach to philosophy, he is someone who started from scratch,, not like you - merely offering a hermeneutical exegesis for a pre-existing structure, the tree of life, simply elaborating and joining the dots together and calling it VO.

And you laugh at the world for being owned by dictionary words - imposed values?

I laugh at you, sweets. You do need a dictionary, to first understand what past means and then starting from scratch means...

*scratch, scratch.. meow pussy

later.

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"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
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Slaughtz



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PostSubject: Re: Spinoza Thu Jun 09, 2016 7:40 pm

Lyssa wrote:
what ideal? - persisting for persisting's sake?!

Making the means the end. If you cannot know the end, then invent some end and declare those who fail in pursuing it as "evil". Those who still use the means are then "evil", for they are ignoring the answer you've provided by not accepting it. They continue to use the means as if the end were not already found out.

Dismember or mutilate your arm if you do not know what it is for.

If you do not know what your imagination is for, then believing in and justifying imagination itself becomes the goal.

Showing weakness, showing ignorance, is a threat of death.  The Jewish death - the considerstion that they might not be deserving of life, as entertained by other people. The best way to tell a lie is to believe it yourself.

Create a knowledge which no other can acquire access to - one which is outside reality itself, such as their gods, and declare that you have seen him and are his spokesman. Who would risk killing the hand/mouth of their Gods? It would certainly anger them if you were wrong in your judgment that they could not be their will manifest.

With multiple Gods,  there were always disagreements in ends, making the means justified as for the will of any combination of God(desse)s. With One God, it became for One end and One goal, which if you failed to move toward, would be evil. One God demands uniformity,  consistency by all believers.  The means are no longer justified but in the pursuit of this One God, and inconsistencies are blasphemies. The means (reason, passion, etc.) are sinful, for they acknowledge a self, an idol which you'd abandon if you had faith in Him.

The "primitive" man seeks to change himself (including his beliefs) to match/adapt to the world. He takes Truth and uses it to cut away at himself. The Jew does the opposite. He cuts at reality (or the perception of reality) itself so that he does not get cut.
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