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Stuart-



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PostSubject: Re: Forums Wed Jan 14, 2015 7:07 am

Addressing compartmentalization.

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PostSubject: Re: Forums Wed Jan 14, 2015 7:40 am

A culture nurtures/represses natural human drives... it sublimates them, but it does not create them.

This is true of all types of manipulation, or training, or whatever you want to call it when behavior is directed.
For example, marketing does not create need in the individual, it directs it or manipulates an already existing need, connecting a product, a symbol, a color a fashion style, with this need.
A con-artist, or a hypnotist, does not magically alter the others thinking, he exploits what is already present in the other - the individual wants to be convinced, to be hypnotized, and this "artist" establishes trust, or makes the other comfortable enough to allow what is there to come forth.

Therefore, gender is not a construct out of nowhere and nothing.
It is a sexual proclivity, nurtured over centuries of natural selection (evolution), resulting in a specialized behavior, and in physical/mental attributes that facilitate this role.
Culture simply connects these predispositions with symbols: words, clothing, forms, colors, styles, rituals, and so on.

In short...what meme is to gene, noumenon to phenomenon, gender is to sexual roles.


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PostSubject: Re: Forums Thu Jan 15, 2015 11:12 am

We have now discovered another truth, using mathematics....
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Crazy wrote:
Nicely done. Did you also notice there are 26 letters in the alphabet?

Presumably God is an English speaker, or French.
Shocked
Mind-blowing, indeed.
I would have thought he spoke Hebrew or Greek, but no the numbers show that he is, in fact, an anglophone.
Greek alphabet has 24 letters.
Not holy enough.
But I'm sure some combination will be found to explain why there are 24, and not 25.

Don't know how many scribbles the Hebrew alphabets has.

Ah, the young....to be forever 26.
God the youthful 26 year-old prankster.

We have mathematical evidence that the universe is built on an Anglo-Saxon/Norman mindset.
This is comforting because now I know that my prayers, although never answered, were, at least, understood by the almighty.
He was ignoring me.

Though, I do have my doubts - forgive me Lord - and He may very well only speak and think in morse code....beep, beeeep, beep, beep, beep beeep....

I bet they can find all kinds of juicy patterns in this sequence...
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Wait, God, the Universe, is sending me a message...
Yes Lord, I'm open to your incoming divine words...speak to me....

F....U....C....K....Y....O....U
What can it mean?
I must break it down mathematically, using my Lord's alphabet...

F = 6
U = 21....2+1=3
C = 3
K = 11...1+1=2

The pause is the place-holding 0.
God's deep breathe.
We'll skip that...

Y = 25...2+5=7
O = 15...1+5=6
U = 21...2+1=3

We always add because we must remain positive thinkers.

So...6+3+3+2+7+6+3 =...wait let me get my calculator, working on the binary system...

30!!!
3+0=3

Wait let me try a different way...
6+21+3+11+25+15+21= 102
1+0+2=3 AGAIN!!!

His message is 30, which is really 3.
The male sex organs are three...2 testicles, corresponding to the mother and the holy ghost, and the penis, the shaft, which is, obviously the Almighty one.
Isn't it clear?
He is giving me the shaft, and his balls are clapping with positive joy, slapping, against my cheeks...which, not coincidentally, are also two.
He is raping me...or making Love to me...fertilizing me.

Wait...wait....there must be more to this...
If I take the three and invert it, positive/negative, we get the three-epsilon, inscribed in Delphi....if we connect the symbols we get an 8
8 is the symbol of infinity...

The 8th letter in the Greek alphabet is theta...in the English one it is H.
H is the symbol of Pisces, and theta is written in Greek as θ which is 8...and is the first letter in the word theos...God
This is getting freaky.

All Pisces are gods...Satyr was born in February and is a Pisces...he is divine.
Can it be more obvious?

Okay, let's take this all the way to where it is taking us...to the END, as it were.

My anus is almost a perfect sphere, my human imperfections notwithstanding.
A sphere is a 0.
My crack is lime a diving line ascross this circle.
It is Pi....Pi = 3.14...
3.1+4

3 morse code (dot) 5

3+5= 8!!!!
My crack is the infinite divide of an infinite divine sphere.
This is freaking me out. I am a genius!!!



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PostSubject: Re: Forums Thu Jan 15, 2015 12:02 pm

Satyr wrote:
We have now discovered another truth, using mathematics....
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]...presumably God is an English speaker, or French.

Mind-blowing, indeed.
I would have thought he spoke Hebrew or Greek, but no the numbers show that he is, in fact, an anglophone.
Greek alphabet has 24 letters.
Don't know how many scribbles the Hebrew alphabets has.

We have mathematical evidence that the universe is built on an Anglo-Saxon/Norman mindset.
This is comforting because now I know that my prayers, although never answered, were, at least, understood by the almighty.

Though, I do have my doubts - forgive me Lord, and He may only talk in morse code....beep, beeeep, beep, beep, beep beeep....



You cannot feel shameless about it, when you have authority figures to back it up. Jung commissioned a Marie von Franz to make J.-Xt. more marketable to those suffering from indigestion with its other-worldy crudities. You could no longer sell it the way it was after enlightenment. It had to be revised - scientifi-ed, so people can feel good about never admitting what depraved hedonists they are.
They can swallow "In the Beginning was the Word" with an "intellectual conscience" now.
Christ is a 'principle', not a person, and it becomes scientific and respectable.

The Nazi fringe had a "White Christianity" thing going - Jesus as gentile version and they had the gnostic [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]. Marie von Franz is like the scientific, respectable version of Blavatsky.

One of Marie's most influential work is one called [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

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"A third field of interest and research was about synchronicity, psyche and matter, and numbers. It seems to have been triggered by Jung, whose research had lead him to the hypothesis about the unity of the psychic and material worlds, i.e., that they are one and the same, just different manifestations. He also believed that this concept of the unus mundus could be investigated by means of researching archetypes. Due to his advanced age, he turned the problem over to von Franz. Two of her books, Number and Time and Psyche and Matter deal with this research. In 1968, von Franz was the first to argue that the mathematical structure of DNA is analogous to that of the I Ching. She cited the I Ching in an essay, Symbols of the Unus Mundus, published in her book Psyche and Matter.

How collective unconscious compensates the one-sidedness of Christianity – this was a basic concern throughout many of her works, not only about fairytales and alchemy, which often compensate or complete the ruling god image of Christianity: In an analysis of the visions of Saint Perpetua, a martyr she writes, that those visions enable us to gain a deep insight into the unconscious spiritual situation of the time. They show the deep conflict of that time, the transition from Paganism to Christianity. “The martyrs appear in many respect as the tragic, unconscious victims of the transformation which was then being fulfilled deep down in the collective stratum of the human soul: the transformation of the image of God“."

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Most of it is Plato and Pythagoras rehashed with J.-Xt.
Egyptian Hieroglyphics were the impetus behind Hebraic mysticism. Persecution played a large part in "hiding the name of the God - YHVH" through numbers and number-relations.
Later this became literalized as the Kabala.

I'm yet to read this:
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Mathematical patterns tend to yield harmony and structure and deep meanings. They shed light on the web of relations. But its something else, like a weakling's dishonesty, to claim that as reality in itself.
In Pythagorean times, and even to Indo-Germanic people, the "cosmos" was Not reality, but the ordered universe and so Pythagoras could reasonable say the "cosmos" has a metre and a musical harmony.
The Indo-Germanics could say chanting and metres "held" the universe.  Sacred vs. Profane was a dimension and a guarded border.

But these biblical slaves merge the poetic cosmos as reality itself.
Whatever.


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PostSubject: Re: Forums Thu Jan 15, 2015 12:10 pm

A case of ordering, static noumenon, and the fluctuating producing disordering, phenomenon.
Of course it has a logic...it is based on an organic process.
Ordering is this self-referential logic....based on the on/off, binary 1/0 neuro-processing method.
It reflects the living organism's self-organizing, within a entropic reality.
Man projects his own functions outwards, and see them reflected back.

Such an organism can only make sense of patterns reflecting what is most intimate to it: its own on/off neurological method.
Beginning as a good/no-good discrimination.
Multiplicity reduced to some-thing/no-thing... where THING is the Lord, God, the UNI-verse....the complete verse.
Once reduced to that all the incomprehensible things are excuses as infinity, evil, the paradox, the complex, and for the Alexandrian minded secular humanist version of the Judeo-Christian nihilistic psychology, the "yet to be known" and/or the "yet to be deciphered, suing the universal code".

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PostSubject: Re: Forums Thu Jan 15, 2015 12:24 pm

Spinoza's immanence theory posits God as one substance with Thought and Extension as its feature.

Jung carries forward Spinoza's phil. saying psyche and matter are a primordial unity that explains synchronicities.

Intelligent design logically becomes the next derivative.
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PostSubject: Re: Forums Thu Jan 15, 2015 12:40 pm

Immanence/Transcendence the inside/outside merging into oneness.
The book-covers of nihilistic holy scripture.

The first begins with the 1, and multiplies it. The idea merges internally.
The noumenon, the abstraction, the word/number as the starting self-evident proposition.
the other begins with the nil, and then posits a one outside of it.
The noumenon is outside the phenomenon.
It creates the phenomenon - it thinks it into existence.

The common ground is the abstraction, the noumenon. The all-unifying, all-inclusive, simplifying/generalizing thought.

Descartes begins with the "I"...which thinks.
Very Christian.

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PostSubject: Re: Forums Thu Jan 15, 2015 12:51 pm

Spinoza's underlying psychology is hedonist.

1. The aversion to change. All "becomings" are only "modifications" of the "same"; this way "Being" is preserved.

2. A history of persecution coupled with a weary will like all hedonists are, feel a need to believe in "goodness" - i.e. to say, justice, order, humanity, "Being", god, whatever name.

The Cartesian split is most evident in these hedonists for whom "Objectivity" means - the subtraction of the physical, the body,, and the mind alone enjoying... they call this fracture - "aesthetics of higher taste".

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
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PostSubject: Re: Forums Thu Jan 15, 2015 12:55 pm

And so pleasure is the most primal experience with the Divine - connecting with God.
When we orgasm we cry "Oh God!"
A moment where need vanishes and consciousnesses under the effect of the endorphin rush has yet to become conscious of a new source of need.
In that moment the sensation of infinite gratification - paradise.
A mind with no purpose.
A mind liberated from the brain - pure noumenon.

The mind freed from its evolutionary purpose of dealing with the organism's needs.
A mind coming, as if, from nowhere, from nothing....no brain to upkeep.
Sensation with no motive.
Mind inebriated by this liberation, yet to be bored, as the satisfaction is ongoing.
It is taken over by it.

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PostSubject: Re: Forums Thu Jan 15, 2015 1:26 pm

That should be a factor to explain Jewish IQ.

Pure-mind idealism has these jewish-in-mindset people waiting for the one with a mental connection, producing the next gen. with intellectual inclinations, and "impartial" objectivists, scholars, logicians...
Such idealism gives these at-bottom-hedonists their charm of self-worth.

But data-metric intelligence alone is not a marker for wholesome health.


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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
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PostSubject: Re: Forums Thu Jan 15, 2015 2:39 pm

A schism, dear...did you not understand?
A detachment.
Like when a mind is numbed by alcohol or any drug.
Detachment from reality...from the stressful, Flux.
An ephemeral moment of sublime disconnection, unconscious/consciousness.
A hovering in faint.
A form of narcissistic self-involvement - solipsism.
Same thing, that makes the idiot on ILP associate numbers, if not words, with the universal code.

When noumenon detaches from phenomenon, then one can imagine it hiding underneath all that inconvenient reality.

I attach the aesthetic to the real...you want to disconnect it, purify it, make it pure thought, pure experience, pleasure with no connection to motive, to process, to purpose.

Do you see, now, why you belong there, and not here?
They are your own...only they use different symbols. You want to stop at the neurological experience of satisfaction...they want to stop at the pure thought, the noumenon, what the brain does with the neurological stimuli, where you stop.
They go a step further.

Keep winking, in that cutesy girly way of yours.... 
I would say "you'll get there" but after so long I do not think you have the mind to realize how need, produces taste, which leads to pleasure.
I think you are stuck in the pleasure creates taste, like other idiots think value precedes judgment...or love proceeds life....
It's the inverted paradigm of Modern Nihilism.

You saying "it is innate, spontaneous" is equivalent to them saying it is "immanent".
You using the word aesthetic, is like them using the word value.
They detach value from judgment, you detach sensuality from need... detaching the noumenon, the sensation, the abstraction, from the experience of the phenomenon which stimulates this process of abstracting, sensing.
Both of you begin with the abstraction, the neurological event...and refuse to consider what stimulates it, what makes it necessary.
They begin with "everything is valuable", as Christians begin by stating that "everything is love"...and you begin with "everything is pleasing."


.....................................


Lyssa wrote:
That should be a factor to explain Jewish IQ.

Pure-mind idealism has these jewish-in-mindset people waiting for the one with a mental connection, producing the next gen. with intellectual inclinations, and "impartial" objectivists, scholars, logicians...
Such idealism gives these at-bottom-hedonists their charm of self-worth.

But data-metric intelligence alone is not a marker for wholesome health.


When the Newtonian system faces Quantum physics the Modern assumes that there must be a unifying harmonious connection.
Not that Newtonian physics, based on this middle-world, perceptual-event-horizon, limit, based on sensuality is contradicted, annulled, when these senses are deepened, using technologies, to where the earlier abstractions no longer hold true, because their generalities/simplifications no longer apply.
Newtonian physics is useful....evidence being that man survived this long using them, even before he had formulated them into concepts and laws, and codified them using letters and numbers.

They do not question their own physics, they assume that there is a unifying M-Theory that will unite them back into their desire ONE.
The trick is, and this is where creativity comes in, to find a logically consistent, self-referential, code that bridges or unites Newtonian and quantum physics.
Either that on abandon one or the other.

Now human abstracting ability is facing a universe in Flux, and it is being contradicted.
Will they realize that all their theories are symbolic, metaphorical?

Not if they are Modern.

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PostSubject: Re: Forums Thu Jan 15, 2015 3:29 pm

I think in cohesive models...not is compartmentalized concepts.

That's what the mind does...and when it cannot, because it is genetically unable, or because ti is afraid, or because ti is brainwashed and adopts all its understanding from others, it compartmentalizes.

One rule here, another there.
One definition here, another there.

Schopenhauer Buddhist detachment is impossible. It involves a form of self-numbing, and depends on supporting elements to not face the ultimate cost for being drunk in yourself
It's why meditation, for me, is only a training, not a lifestyle.

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PostSubject: Re: Forums Thu Jan 15, 2015 6:27 pm

Connection does not automatically mean moral.

You connect the sensation to something in the past...to nature.

Aesthetic is the evaluation of a phenomenon, as it compares to a need.

Our need determines our tastes and our aesthetic appreciation.
We as organisms appreciate order, organization, symmetry, harmony, all expressions of order, and all probabilities, highly.

You can stop at the sensation.
I want to know why.
True, knowing why reduces the effect of the automatic sensation...but I value awareness more than anything else.

And so to quiet my mind, to let go, I drink.
I drink for the effect, not to become drunk.
And when I drink my Dionysian side emerges, and my normal Apollonian personality slumbers, uncaring.



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PostSubject: Re: Forums Wed Jan 21, 2015 8:15 am

Satyr wrote:
A culture nurtures/represses natural human drives... it sublimates them, but it does not create them.

This is true of all types of manipulation, or training, or whatever you want to call it when behavior is directed.
For example, marketing does not create need in the individual, it directs it or manipulates an already existing need, connecting a product, a symbol, a color a fashion style, with this need.
A con-artist, or a hypnotist, does not magically alter the others thinking, he exploits what is already present in the other - the individual wants to be convinced, to be hypnotized, and this "artist" establishes trust, or makes the other comfortable enough to allow what is there to come forth.

Therefore, gender is not a construct out of nowhere and nothing.
It is a sexual proclivity, nurtured over centuries of natural selection (evolution), resulting in a specialized behavior, and in physical/mental attributes that facilitate this role.
Culture simply connects these predispositions with symbols: words, clothing, forms, colors, styles, rituals, and so on.

In short...what meme is to gene, noumenon to phenomenon, gender is to sexual roles.


----------

I may have benefitted from rereading the above before writing this post. I try explaining not so much the connection between gender and sex, but that they need not be considered near completely distinct, even unrelated terms, despite what the consensus in that thread seems to be. Furthermore, I explain how the term gender is being misused by the soft-sciences in conjunction with liberal subcultures.

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Stuart wrote:
wolfhnd wrote:
Stuart wrote:
I use the terms [gender and sex] as I've always used them and learned to use them from listening to others, which is essentially interchangeably.

That would be fine accept we are in the social sciences forum and in that context they are not interchangeable.

For the social sciences the definition for gender is:

Gender refers to the personal sexual identity of an individual, regardless of the person's biological and outward sex. How people define masculinity and femininity can vary based on the individual's background and surrounding culture. Differing societal expectations in different cultures establish the behavioral, psychological and physical attributes that are associated one gender or another.

According to the first sentence of your definition, the particular gender and/or sex that a person is sexually attracted to, would be an attribute of that person's gender. - What would signify a person's "sexual identity" more than the sex that person is attracted to? After all the two sexes evolved for reproductive purposes, reproduction evolving first attraction then copulation.

The rest of you definition is just about defining gender. I realize that some obscure cultures consider people to change sex or gender throughout their life, and have in-between stages they consider people to be in. What I recall is that the cultures, not having anything close to modern science, often consider those stages to be as much a fact as the difference between a large person and a small person, and don't always concern themselves with choice or personal preference.

It makes sense to separate the term gender and sex concerning anthropological studies of cultures lacking modern science, because then when speaking of it we can clearly demonstrate the difference between what a person's sex/gender is (according to science), and what that person's sex/gender (is according to the non-scientific way the people in that culture view reality) - using the term sex for the former and gender for the latter.

But, in modern western culture, where we have modern science, if we wish to define various types of sex/genders and/or stages of sex/genders, we may as well use the tools at our disposal, mainly biology. What we find, of course is that there are a reasonable number of cases of people of mixed sex/gender - not because they claim as much or behave in a way that would make others claim as much, but because of physical features and genetics.

Psychology and sociology are ridiculously soft sciences in comparison to biology. And when they try to subvert the hard-sciences, even if in the devious way of picking one synonym and trying to separate it from the other, they're far out of line. I don't claim that various cultures (or call them subcultures) should give way to science at all times, but that it should be understood that science is not part of a particular culture, just like any other, but encompass what's called western civilization. Western civilization is largely integrated into eastern civilization, and likely has almost a hundred major languages which the major scientific publications are translated into.

So while the sciences' attempt to normalize cultures, or in other words, destroy cultures, leaving nothing but a homogeneous mass called western culture, is understandable, even if not necessarily desirable, the soft sciences are being ridiculous when they try to compete with the hard sciences. After all, a homogenized culture consisting of billions of people, could conceivably be held together by the principals of physics and the biology which owes it's existence largely to physics, but has less chance when concerning behavior or statistical studies concerning psychology or sociology.

Basically what I'm trying to say is if one's from what we would call a traditional culture, they'd have their own way of considering sex/gender and possible some dichotomy of the two, and as they're westernized they may have little problem accepting the hard sciences determinations for sex/gender and simply keep their old determinations separate (and I assume that giving the former the designation sex, and the latter gender, is perfectly reasonable).

But, then we have a culture/non-culture such as American culture, which hardly differs from the cultures/non-cultures in the other major English speaking countries. There we can rely on science alone as the force which changes our way of speaking, where the hard sciences are so far beyond the soft sciences that the soft sciences need not be heeded; or we can rely on tradition, which doesn't use the term gender outside of linguistics anyway; or we can operate within various subcultures.

But, I'm not in one of the various subcultures that have adopted the relatively new way of differentiating sex and gender (and have adopted the wide array of terms describing sex/gender/orientation), so while your claim that I must differentiate sex and gender because we are in the social science forum may have some ground, you would certainly have no ground otherwise.
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PostSubject: Re: Forums Wed Jan 21, 2015 9:26 am

Stuart wrote:
mudturtle wrote:
See there's the problem we have a self described conservative heterosexual man

I only began to get personal after how personal and off topic you let this thread get.

Quote :
running around bashing the vile hypocritical gays without doing the necessary research and being sloppy with his language.

I have only "bashed" anyone here in the sense of calling them hypocritical, for having hypocritical views, which I repeatedly explained, not for their orientation. You've been sloppy earlier thinking I was claiming sexual orientation was largely a choice. And this is further slop.

Quote :
One of the outcomes of this is that I know view you and your half-baked argument as bigotry meant to demeamonize gays.

You don't even understand my argument. And before you speak to my motives, as if this thread was due to an inherent bias I've long had, look at my back posts.

Quote :
Like most heterosexuals I've encountered you want to pitch these ideas in terms of others' sexuality rather than in terms of you own and the majorities heterosexuality and accused them of being vile.

I never accused homosexuals of being vile. If this helps, I believe one is no less a hypocrite to claim heterosexuals have no choice, but gender is a choice, as it is to claim homosexuals have no choice, but gender is a choice.

muddled-turtle wrote:
because I've been taunted I'm locking the thread. Call gays vile or similarly again staurt and i will not give you the benefit of the doubt but ban you immediately.
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PostSubject: Re: Forums Fri Jan 23, 2015 7:26 am

Wosret wrote:
If I were lying, or lied, you wouldn't be able to accuse me of all of this. Of course I moralize, and I oppress based on it. I said that I'm only human.

I contended merely that my moralizing is reactionary, based on the denigration of myself, and my fellows. I'm at war, I hardly claim to be above it all, or to have absolute right and wrong on my side. I have contingent right and wrong on my side, based on who I identify with, and the allegiances I hold.

An ideal world where everyone accepts the truth, and the correct morality is just delusion, not delusion because it is impossible that the world could hold these truths, and these values, but delusion to think that they aren't mine -- that I don't propose slavery to my ideals.

That aside, to clarify, I never said that I go around claiming that it's all nature, and nothing to do with nurture, I said what I think that the motive for doing so is, and how I find deceptions that benefit me less annoying than deceptions that oppress me.

I gave some points in favor of nature just to show its part, but it doesn't determine, just predisposes.

I do plan to make my way better into my community, and to fight for my cause. For my truths, for my values.

Stuart wrote:
You're at war, the outcome being substantial, meaning of an easily demonstratable effect. In such a war, honest and any other ideology will not get in the way. Most importantly is that you give the readers here the benefit of the doubt and don't give them the same line of propaganda, that you, or at least your comrades, do offline and on more common places online. Your not a hypocrite.

Wosret wrote:
You're using your imagination to slander me, or supposing that I'm responsible for everyone on my general political, social side. Clearly you just have some ax to grind, some point to make.

Stuart wrote:
You claim I slandered you, but please tell me one thing I said that's not based on your own words above.

I said 'comrades', not 'minions', so your second statement has no foundation. Also, I have an axe to grind? You're the one at war.

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I've never seen a topic where people get so easily enraged as this. Mudturtle banned me from his forum, I wonder how long until I get banned from the above.
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PostSubject: request for review Fri Jan 23, 2015 7:31 am

I plan on trying this again. This is my latest essay on the issue. This time I'd like to wait for anyone here to read it, and give advice, before posting it on other forums.

"Sexual orientation, gender, the blank slate theory, and inconsistencies concerning them."

Descriptions of the term "gender":

Gender Description 1 (GD1): Before the 1970s it was used as little more than a grammatical classification. It's still used in such a way when speaking of language and linguistics.

Gender Description 2 (GD2): In the 70s the word began to be often used to refer to a particular mental characteristics (which is manifested through behavior), even if more of a defining characteristic, which is generally based on types of behavior generally associated with one sex or the other.

Basically, according to this usage of the term, many people can have some, or most, behavioral characteristics generally based on the sex which they are not. Often people in this situation will be called feminine males or masculine females - the adjective referring to gender and the noun to sex. Or some may simply say that concerning gender they are male or they're female, and concerning sex, not necessarily corresponding to their gender, they're male or they're female.

Some who use the term in this way consider the particular gender people have to be entirely unrelated to their sex.

Gender Description 3 (GD3): The term is also used, at least since the 70-80s, as a direct synonym for sex, when people are speaking in a non-scientific context. For example, if one wishes to know if one's future boss will be a biological male or a female, one would be more likely to ask, "What's that person's gender?", than, "What's that person's sex?"

(Also, it's worth mentioning the terms "gender role" and "sexual role". The former  is a particular type of social role unrelated to any direct aspect of reproduction, the latter is considered by some exclusively related directly to reproduction, and by others to also constitute much, if not all, of what others consider to fall under gender roles. There's a debate as to whether gender roles are mostly, if not entirely, social constructs, or are mostly, if not entirely, roles that evolved due to behavior most suited for each of the two sexes. Whatever the cases may be, the two terms are both roles, meaning they are not characteristics of a person, mentally nor physically, and therefore are irrelevant to this discussion.)

--------------------

The Blank Slate Theory:

It emphasizes nurture over nature when it comes to mental characteristics which are manifested through behavioral characteristics. To be clear, it doesn't state that genetics aren't a factor is mental characteristics; apparently the theory claims there's a standard concerning particular aspects of genetics which nearly all people meet. So all but the few exceptions who fail in that standard (people with mental disabilities due to genetics for example) have at conception a virtually equal potential for intelligence, personality, interests and other mental characteristics (which are manifested through behavior).

Sexual Orientation:

It's not a direct physical attribute, therefore it's a mental characteristic (which is manifested through behavior), even if more of a defining characteristic. This is true even assuming genetics are mostly what define one's sexual orientation. Basically, people can only tell other people's sexual orientation from the others' behavior (which includes the others actually speaking of their orientation) and possibly (at least some day in the future) from studying a DNA sample of theirs.

--------------------

The majority of those involved in the soft sciences, and those with any active role in various groups and organizations advocating for homosexuals in various ways (if not the majority of people in the western world itself) believe that sexual orientation is not something one learns (I'll refer to those people as Group A).

They believe that sexual orientation is either purely genetic or due to both genetics and environmental factors (especially during gestation) which have little if nothing to do with the actual education or experience of that person.

Since most of those attracted to the same sex are either fully biologically male or fully biologically female, and fully capable of reproducing with the opposite sex, sexual orientation is not entirely an aspect of biological sex. Clearly what parts of sexual orientation do not relate to biological sex relate to gender, as described in GD2.

My assumption is that most in Group A don't claim that gender (GD2) is entirely based on nurture, but that most do claim that at least some aspects of one's gender (GD2) are mostly based on nurture (or through what they advocate, lead one to that conclusion).

--------------------

Does anyone in Group A advocate the blank slate theory?

Or does anyone in Group A claim gender (GD 2) is entirely based on nurture (whether or not you advocate any other aspects of the blank slate theory)?

For the above; you can probably see where I find an inconsistency in your beliefs, would you please explain.

Also, does anyone in Group A claim gender (GD 2) is partially based on nurture? If so please elaborate.
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PostSubject: Re: Forums Fri Jan 23, 2015 7:36 am

It cuts into the heart of the Modern psyche.
This need for nurture to exceed nature, so as to make them and all of existence malleable, correctable, escapable.

The sum of all nurturing, past/nature, is now corrected in a single lifetime, or a few years of "proper" conditioning.
This is social eugenics, which they call "education" or culture.

This implies self-repression.
And self-repression is hiding, lying, being a hypocrite when what you think does not correspond to what you say.

Modern schizophrenia....neurosis of the discontents, pretending to be "happy".

They want to deny that this is even necessary, so as to then return to the pretentiousness, as if it were genuine.


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PostSubject: Re: Forums Fri Jan 23, 2015 7:45 am

Satyr wrote:
And self-repression is hiding, lying, being a hypocrite when what you think does not correspond to what you say.

Wosret accused me of slander simply for summarizing her post. She can't tolerate her own words for longer than it takes for the ink to dry.
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PostSubject: Re: Forums Fri Jan 23, 2015 7:59 am

It's about how these types cannot follow their own conclusions to their logical end.
I've found that imbeciles adopt a position based no emotional appeal, but have no clue what this conclusion implies. They haven't come to the conclusion themselves, following the reasoning, but have adopted it, as a conclusion.

This is top<>down thinking.
Begin with a satisfying outcome, a gratifying conclusion, and then justify it later.

When you point out what they are saying implies, they become frustrated, afraid, ...they are exposed as the morons that they are.
They get upset.

Then, they want you gone.
I've experienced this many times.

The "I know all that" is how they display how they do not UNDERSTAND what they know.
Like their anti-race positions.

Ask them to explain how evolution works if traits are uniformly distributed automatically, and if all have the same potentials.
Why even have a natural selection process....why choose?

Ask them to explain how species come about.
How from a common ancestry genetic splintering proceeds gradually, from less towards more divergence, to the point where cross-reproduction ceases to be an option.
They can't, while at the same time preserving their desired outcome: equality, human uniformity....all-inclusive parity...the comforting unity of HUMANITY.

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PostSubject: Re: Forums Mon Feb 02, 2015 9:19 pm

You guys remember this turd uwot on [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] and his "you can't say anything about a group by studying one member of that group" pseudo-intellectual thesis that contradicted the basic tenets of empiricism and science?

uwot-Dimwit wrote:
You are the fool who believes they can categorize entire races and not bother discriminating between individuals.

Satyr wrote:


I know...like science categorizes entire species or entire cultures or entire population groups.
Simply evil.

I suggest you teach scientists that they must deal with each individual bear or wolf or sheep before they dare come up with general behavioral and physical attributes.

A category, simpleton, indicates potential.
Genes establish it within parameters. Individuals and their nurturing are placed within these parameters, and the exceptions to the rule supports the rule and requires explanation.
You want to be comforted. You are not interested in seeing the world as it is.
So, instead of accepting categories you prefer to focus on the exceptions because this gives you hope that all categories are false and freedom reigns and the past has no determining effects on the present or the future.

Good times.

Another den-of-dimwits.

The little bitches still remember...
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Too bad little bitches do not have testicles to come and face me where I lurk.

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PostSubject: Re: Forums Tue Feb 03, 2015 2:51 pm

A new alpha-male beckons.
He's already reminisced about the "good ol' days" before he got trapped by his own desperate needs.
A Satyr in the making?
Another pretender?
A degenerate crotch-sniffer who once suckled on the Spinozean "member" Dunamis, to gain strength, and now looking for a new inspiration to deal with his genetic inefficiencies?

We'll see.
He's already manipulated the Sauwelios bitch-man to serve him.
That (s)he (Sauwelios), once Nietzschean and now openly Jewified Strausean - Nietzsche Modernized) could never resist the temptation of greatness, and like all (wo)men (s)he wishes to be fertilized by a genius to give birth to a natural wonder, to acquire infamy through association...and fails because his feminine spirit was born in a man-child's body, making her a natural follower.
The exhibitionist's dangling berries must have been too much for her to resist.  

But, what he, the newborn goat-man, lacks in judgment, and self-control, he might make-up in seductive attractiveness, and charm.
He implies that he only exposed himself in public one time, and it is this one time that got him arrested, making his success rate 0%, or his lying rate 100%.
I, for one, know of at least one other story of him exposing himself in public, and of other tales that expose him in a different way.
There is another "bulge" I see.

That Sauwelios would submit to him, is also interesting.
Intellectual integrity appears to be a fault.
Who else would interpret Nietzsche in a modern way without feeling a bit ashamed?
Exposing a deficient self appears to be the common trait of the shamelessly degenerate.
It has become a source of pride.
They exhibit it, thou it may expose more than what they want to.    

A greener [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.].

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PostSubject: Re: Forums Thu Feb 12, 2015 8:54 pm

He's scurried into the shadows now, but I remember shit-Stain claiming how, when he was sent to the psychotherapists (imagine someone so healthy being sent there), he had them wrapped around his finger...and then there was the endless bragging, how important he was, how he cavorted with intelligent, well-connected men, how wonderful his life was, while day-after-day there he was seeking, wanting; proclaiming that women loved him, and then, declaring his indifference for philosophy, how he knew all that, went to school,, had studied and dismissed it, had forgotten more than most knew...and so on.
Preemptive victory dances abounded....like on the documentary channel.
One moment they are "above it all" the next they are "in the middle of it all"...they "walk the walk" when others can only "talk the talk" and there they are, day-after-day, talking the talk.

I guess there are plenty of Negroes superior to Goethe and Spinoza, because they are right there in the mix, on the streets, with the diamond earrings, and the sparkling hoods, living the playas life...taking care of business, learning in the school of "hard knocks"...prisons full of them....these geniuses of everyday life.
The rabble.
Every simple act of reason and discipline becomes a testament of brilliance only when one has tripped and fallen, on his damn face, a dozen times....until finally "eureka!!" he gets it

It's the typical American, lost, white-trash, psychology of the modern era of lost pasts and forgotten inheritances....boys brought-up by weak mothers and inadequate or feeble, fathers posturing in the only way they've learned how, from TV adds and blockbuster flicks.

Like shit-Stain on ILP, if you ask him to expand on his positions, which he never does, he will refer, defer, or use some quip, some song-and-dance, to pretend he has a secret nobody can have, unless they give themselves to him.
You aren't worthy.
Remember Adam?
Ha!!!
He, too, declared himself genius, with knowledge only few could share...and never see.
I've watched douche-bags, like that, using transparent word-games, to manipulate lesser imbeciles and find lost pride in dominating manimals, a bit dumber than they are.
It's embarrassing to watch, when you're emphatic, feeling the shame they can never feel, because they are cynically shameless, and too thick to feel more than an orgasm.



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PostSubject: Re: Forums Thu Feb 12, 2015 9:50 pm

The process always follows the same predictable pattern, once you recognize the type.  



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PostSubject: Re: Forums Thu Feb 12, 2015 10:53 pm

Never disturb a specimen when it's running the maze you built for it.


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PostSubject: Re: Forums Thu Feb 12, 2015 11:00 pm

Men used to raise families and fight in wars when in their twenties...now, in their mid-thirties, some wear tight pants, visit WalMart where they push forward their erection to get noticed by young girls, destined to die alone, after they've completely destroyed their life.
In between probation officer visits they are living "the life".
Hard and street-smart, they have no time for philosophy. They know the words, at least, to pretend they've understood things like none of those faggots that study it, ever could.

In their sixties?
A creepy lunatic, with his pants around his throat, thinking of using the belt to end it all.
Why kick a dead ass?
Let it live what life is left to it.
Who cares?

And now...I think I'm done with it.
My lesson learned, put in my place, I have some wounds to lick and some regrets to deal with....HA!!!

I still hear an echo....
Something about peeping toms, interracial porn, masturbating in parking lots...and me, with my psychobabble, know it, for what it is.
A drop in a bucket of despair.

How can words coming from a nihilist affect Satyr?

Ta, Ta,



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PostSubject: Re: Forums Thu Mar 12, 2015 6:30 pm

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Νι-Βι wrote:
As the saying παντα ρει already implies, only things can flow.

HA!!!

Ni-Bi wrote:
Pure flow is therefore flow of nothing: there is flowing, but nothing that flows.
Indeed...no-thing flows.

We'll have to wait for a clarification as to the identity of this some-thing.
Until then, have faith, pray, and hope.

The idol breaker's worshiper is now finding new idols to worship.
Except for Strauss, there's this thing, that is but is secret, hidden, out there, and in there...some-where, where some-things come from.

In Top<>Down thinking, as in Nihilism, one begins with a truth one has no reason to believe in, and no way to explain, and no reference point to refer to, given that it is, after all absolutely there.
Then, one moves backward trying to explain the absence of said thing in a world where no evidence of it exists.

Like christian belief in the God of victims.

Two peas join forces, sharing a pod.

ILP is amazing.

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PostSubject: Re: Forums Sun Mar 15, 2015 9:25 pm

Ha!!!
Right again.
True to your name.

I love these MENSA members.

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PostSubject: Re: Forums Mon Mar 16, 2015 2:19 am

Silhoutte, your reading skills are poor.
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PostSubject: Re: Forums Sun Mar 29, 2015 1:40 pm

Brilliant!!!

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Magnus Anderson wrote:
When reality becomes too complex for the individual, the individual is forced to falsify it by reducing it to a manageable level of complexity. This can manifest itself as will to simplicity/order (reduction to silence, self-denial, masochism) or will to complexity/chaos (increase of complexity to the point of noise/blindness, intensification and multiplication of desire, hedonism.)



Values.

What is good? Order.
What is bad? Chaos.

What is order? Repetition, pattern, resistance to change, inactivity so to speak.
What is chaos? Change, activity so to speak.

What is change? It is a relation between two states.
What is life? Ordering.
What is ordering? Resistance to change, trying to remain true to your habits (to your past) as much as possible.

When change/chaos is not properly absorbed, the change manifests itself as an excess, in the direction of masochism (willful suppression of one's habits) or in the direction of hedonism (willful intensification and multiplication of one's habits.)



So what are Fixed and Sauwelios? I think they are hedonists

Someone, finally, said it out-loud!

Another word is materialists, subjectivists, perspectivists, Nihilists....Moderns.
Semites.
Or Idiots.

If it feels good, it is good.

Philosophy reduced to politics - social dynamics.
Not about the world, which includes mankind - on a tiny speck in the middle of vastness - but about man (humanism) as the arrogant representative of the cosmos.

The human subjective, wanting to become a universal subjective....in opposition, or in ignorance of, the objective, indifferent, world.


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PostSubject: Re: Forums Mon Mar 30, 2015 12:57 pm

Quote :
Tell me, kid. If I act as I please, using myself as reference for my actions, does that differ from nobility as described by Nietzsche?

HA!!!
In between sound bites, and pleasuring herself, she never found the time to actually read what she now gathers from Semitic interpreters.
To be noble is to claim to be noble....
"I say so"
The words suffice.
I am what I declare myself being.
If I say-so, I am-so, because there is no other external standard to decide.
And that is why on ILP many assert their own genius and say no more.
To be genius is like beauty - in the eye of the beholder, and if you convince others of it, who are beholden, then you are.  

Presumably Nietzsche was a hedonist, and his concept of nobility is referring to self to justify actions.
So, a form of solipsism, of masturbation - the pleasuring of self with self.
Nietzsche was also pro-Semitic, envisioning a United States of Europe where the Semite, and the Abrahamic religions, were the all-encompassing ideal.
The multi-cultural, uni-racial (human), asexual future of the Last Man.  
His anti-antisemitism has gone over their heads.

Females really only need the "I choose so" as their argument.
No reasoning, no references except self, as emotion, sensation, feeling.

I am glad ILP gathers them all together.
The Hydra with its many heads, with that monstrous body.
Chop one off, and two more grow in its place.
The multiplicity of monism, the varieties of nihilism disconnecting from a world that would restrict such infantile games.

What is order?
Restriction of possibility
What is chaos?

Infinite possibility

And in the infinite possible is where the Nihilist finds his place.
The central them, the common body remains ONE.

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PostSubject: Re: Forums Mon Mar 30, 2015 1:51 pm

Satyr wrote:
Quote :
Tell me, kid. If I act as I please, using myself as reference for my actions, does that differ from nobility as described by Nietzsche?

Where is this quote pulled from?
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PostSubject: Re: Forums Mon Mar 30, 2015 2:04 pm

It's almost as if you had no past, I could draw from, and that you had no clue but only enjoyed the reaction.

Feed, feed, that hunger.

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PostSubject: Re: Forums Mon Mar 30, 2015 2:07 pm

And nobility is?
For you, a word boys play with, like cock.

...or do you only allude, insinuate, play games to snicker and flee?

One foot on that fence post, the other seven on different fence posts....the abdomen floating in air, "as if" it were immune to gravity.

What a long way you've come since sciforums kid.
And how different from spuriousmonkey days.
The style is almost an imitation.

As if...

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PostSubject: Re: Forums Mon Mar 30, 2015 2:21 pm

Nice deflection...
You are clueless.
This is your feminist tactic....a Socratic method.
Socrates as Diogenes, masturbating, defecating in public, as a display of his Independence.

Shit on all of it so that in the end your pussy orgasms remain as the only thing you can depend upon.  

How easy to play the field when you make no commitments, and you are only there to toy, and play, and pretend this is your genius.
Some would call that trolling, but when pussy is involved the standards change, as does the style.

With no position other than your orgasm, you can pretend to say something here, then deny you meant anything by it and then say something else there, and move on, and then return, and hide, and then reveal yourself, as a tease, and then retreat...and so on and so on.

Nobility for you?
Bullshit.
Right woman?

Until then, play with the men-children, and expose them as what they are.

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PostSubject: Re: Forums Mon Mar 30, 2015 3:07 pm

Did not Diogenese masturbate on the middle of the square to make the point that love is not mystical but lust and farted in the room filled with persons talking about (human) divinity as to say ''is my fart also apart of the divine plan of the Higher''?

Confronting them with actions representing basic human behaviour they mostly do at home and suppress outside; and talk about something higher as if such is not apart of their behaviour, to confront their ideals with their common ''secret'' actions.
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PostSubject: Re: Forums Mon Mar 30, 2015 3:52 pm

Laconic, emotive, brilliant.

Do you not wish to be "written off"?
Shall I trust you to be true?

We shall watch and see.

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PostSubject: Re: Forums Mon Mar 30, 2015 3:59 pm

Among the ones who are so humbly certain they deserve super-models, and their genius is being spread across the globe, and that whenever he is acknowledged it is a victory, a tiny little boy screams to be heard: I matter.

For a next trick translating the Torah into modernistic terms, and selling it as something great, and new.

The Bible has already been Hellenized.

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PostSubject: Re: Forums Tue Mar 31, 2015 11:44 am

How wonderfully the average expose their herd instincts.

Being is Existing
Love is God
Argument is Assertion
Female is Male
Many is One

Little mind games for the mindless.


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PostSubject: Re: Forums Tue Mar 31, 2015 1:09 pm

In the end the "Because I say so" overrides all concerns.

Not fact, but will, governed, directed, by need.
I will what I need, and what I need becomes a universal truth.
The reduction of the objective to the subjective, where the disconnect between the two makes of the subjective increasingly absurd, and applicable.
We sample from Nietzsche his polemic against Christianity and then propose a Christian solution to the results.
The idol breaker is idolized.


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