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 Thougts on Jordan Peterson

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nanobotti



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PostSubject: Thougts on Jordan Peterson Tue Jun 13, 2017 5:24 am



Hi, I came here to actually ask your opinions on the man and his ideas. Most of you probably know him as he has been in news and stirring the alternative thinking and free speech scene for years now.  

To kick this off I think he is coward. He attacks the low hanging fruit, and morally signals not to be totalitarian, authoritarian, Nazi, communist, fascist, etc. He talks nihilistically about morality, in therms of absolutes, and equates moral goodness to words like freedom and equality, making them seem something more then just moral abstractions. And from that fallacy he asserts that "authority" or "totalitarianism" are in themselves morally bad, and thus never actually explaining what is morally wrong in authority/totalitarianism.

He has lot of material uploaded in YT, and after listening to him for weeks I see so many contradictions in his world view. He compartmentalizes many of his views so he can make sense of it, so his own ignorance and cognitive dissonance doesn't show. In one hand he says people should assert themselves, rescue their father, masculine virtue, to take their own side, in Jungian perspective to become some what a hero archetype, and yet he doesn't seem to see the contradiction when it comes to authority/totalitarianism/Fascism which in essence is masculinity, to take one own side.  

Also one of his usual moralistic tricks is to point to established mainstream history which is essentially propaganda for those parties that are in power. The past is full of demonized losers, and victors are always morally virtuous. Historical objectivity is clearly not what he is after. And the fact that he repeatedly makes moral suggestions from historical examples is essentially a cowards way out. He doesn't need to explain why something is morally wrong or good, as "history shows us". This type of dishonesty is essential in him, as I see him very dishonest. He is clearly well read and also intelligent, yet he is a sophistic, and not arguing from honesty, and this is something of disappointment. He also refuses to see the obvious ideological and moral differences between political and ideological trends, he lumps them up to be the same because it is convenient. He refuses to see differences morally and ideologically between monarchy, anarchism, or communism and fascism. For example in the case of communism and Nazism they were morally structured differently, which is essence of the whole society. Both had different moral and ideological motivation not only in simple moral memes and rhetoric, but also in deeper meta level. One build their morality around abstract concept of equality and other their tribe, actual persons, the people. To equate those two just because they were "socialist" is intellectually wrong and lazy.  

That all being said... I kind of like him and in a sense root for him.

He says many things I agree, but I can sense a fear. Now I wouldn't mind the fear, as a fear is natural. Let's not forget he is facing the system so to speak. It's dangerous and it healthy to fear danger, especially when the stakes are high like with his situation. So in a sense I cannot blame the guy. He is alone after all, and going against the machine. Essentially he is trying to keep some "moral" back door open, while attacking the morality of the SJW and post-modernism. This would essentially be a career ender for most people, but he has successfully kept resistance alive and growing, but I fear that he is doing more harm then good in the long run, because he is not realistically pointing out the nihilistic abstractions of equality and freedom and trying to build a moral framework around them, and because he has gathered a huge cultish following he has huge potential to make change.

He might do all this in porpoise knowing that he is arguing intellectually lazy, or actually believe what he spits. I assume he is stirring up the deck of cards knowing full well that the shuffle he is doing is false.
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PostSubject: Re: Thougts on Jordan Peterson Tue Jun 13, 2017 6:25 am

Well, he is a fan of Jung, and Jung was Christian in his outlook.
I appreciate his efforts against postmodernism, within the confines of its political-correctness.
His career and his reach through its legitimization of his voice, are at stake. I cannot blame him his reluctance to go beyond a certain point, if he does, indeed, harbour any secret sentiments he is reluctant to expose.
I recall how he minimized race as a factor in determining intelligence.
He is more open in his commentary on women and the current identity crisis.

Any voice of reason against this insanity is welcomed, even if it is self-censoring.

Can't say if he is being dishonest or simply restricting himself to within the limits imposed upon him by the system, so that he is not silenced and cast aside as another European authoritarian.
He is creating a shift, within a segment of the young, whoa re still open to ideas and are not as deeply infected by the dis-ease of nihilism.

This War like no Other, as I call it, is a different kind of conflict.
It is noetic, or feminine in its tactics.
If you use masculine tactics it will have the opposite to the intended outcome.
To fight an enemy you must adopt his methods.
Fighting guerrilla warfare,, for example, using conventional means will result in defeat.
Fighting female psychologies, and emasculated "males", is like fighting children.
You must adopt their methods to deal with them.

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PostSubject: Re: Thougts on Jordan Peterson Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:48 pm

He is an academic and sophist, thus reliant and dependent upon the system for money and popularity. He benefits from his views by the increase in popularity, and has a career to consider. Even if he had further, more disruptive views, then he maybe self-censoring them. I like him because he goes much further than other academics and intellectuals. In that regard, he is a good measure and marker for the current times.

You're right to critique his points about morality. I've not been impressed from what I've heard. What impressed me about Peterson is his willingness to expose many fragments of modernity, and in response to the "LGBTQ" proclamations on gender-pronouns. The Law is a serious affair. And so he is reacting to that nobly, and putting his foot down. In other words, there are degrees by which Moderns must 'tolerate' modernity (regarding the LBGTQ, fag movement).

What is LGBTQ by the way? It is a *Hedonist* movement, young people being "educated" (indoctrinated) to suck each-other's dicks, vaginas, to pretend to be each-other's gender, to pretend to be oppressed, to pretend to be victims. It is a mentally ill ideology, formulated by social pretenses.

But, how far ought the average Modern go, to pretend that he supports and is "proud" of Gay Rights? That's more what Peterson and his popularity is about. How far ought society go, to support the delusions of a small minority? Very far? Must people change language, behavior, everyday life? Must you change your very thoughts?

Fortunately, right now, liberal-leftism does not have that much power. Hopefully it does not, in the future, too.
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PostSubject: Re: Thougts on Jordan Peterson Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:59 pm

EDIT: wrong thread


Last edited by Æon on Wed Jun 14, 2017 12:01 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: Thougts on Jordan Peterson Tue Jun 13, 2017 8:54 pm

Peterson is a staunch psychoanalyst and his psychological approaches come first to anything he thinks about, as he himself admits, which means he is inadvertently impartial and objective. Morality is something he gives lip service to due to his academic prestige and reputation in the educational institution.

He has a lot to lose, and he knows how to exercise some caution in his teachings in tandem with the intractability of leftist censorship. He doesn't have much choice but to appease and placate a system that rejects anything of strong values or principles or ideas. Most academics have a difficult time reconciling their ideas with principles or virtues, because of how ardently they are despised in university environments. Call it dishonesty if you must, but i simply call it survival. I wouldn't however, call him a coward. He has proven his courage to challenge the status quo, and not simply with the LGBTQ bullshit, which is nothing more than a triviality, but with his support for a mythos of masculinity, his rejection of feminization, which is very important, and his strong promotion of the idea of Man embracing his primal nature as a way to 'civilized power', which is something about his philosophy i like.

His beliefs or standpoints on race superiority is something he will always be impartial and circuitous about. Steven Pinker does the same thing, but his brilliant biological expositions on human nature compensate for it.

The way he thinks is very genuine to me. He has a discursive and wandering intellectual plight. He strikes me as a passionate and serious thinker.  And he respects philosophy and understands Nietzsche pretty well and admires him. All very good marks to win my approval, despite any airs he might put on for practical purposes. At some point, at least for me, cynicism or discontent has to find a resting point. In these times, as Satyr points out, a strong voice against the intellectual degradation is welcome.

He is philosophically inclined and has a sense of philosophy's spirit, but in the end he is mostly an academic and that comes with knowing how to be a rhetorician when he has to. The good attributes in him outweigh the bad for me.
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PostSubject: Re: Thougts on Jordan Peterson Mon Jul 10, 2017 5:00 pm

Peterson is good, but he often gets too Judeo-Christian on me to fully impress.
Like a gorgeous woman with a funny snort, for a laugh.
You are taken by her, and then she breaks the spell when she laughs....but you still have sex with her.

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