Dionysus versus Apollo.

Kovacs wrote:

TheJoker wrote:

Not just brutal but selfish, egotistical, selfish, hedonistic, materialistic, and power driven.

Would humans be so unlike most social mammals? Most exhibit all sorts of relationship prioritizations not listed here. The above sounds like a combination of a sociopath and someone with Aspberger's Syndrome.

Are you assuming that all empathy is really guilt?

What is social interaction exhibited by human beings other than collective psychosis Kovacs?



Call it collective sociopathy if you like.

I sometimes like to look at civilization like it's a continual ongoing violent orgy of mayhem.

It's really not far off the mark when using history as a reference.

Quote :

Are you assuming that all empathy is really guilt?

What is empathy?

Kovacs even empathy can be manipulated as there is no altruism of a self acting selflessly.

The self can only promote it's own interests even when supposedly trying to commit so called selfless acts.

With the human being the ego reigns supreme.

TheJoker wrote:

Ironic how my yuppy pal?

If you study a variety of pagan religions all across the world the trickster element is a predominant archetype. It is one I can definately relate to.

The Greek Apollo or Dionysus are a bit too civilized for my liking.

I'm more of a barbarian.

This is because the Hellenes were worshipers of Apollo more than they were of Dionysus...they were a masculine civilization trying to pout the world in order with these categories.
They looked down on the Barbarians with their madness.

Dionysus had his priestesses (notice that they were female) the Hysterias...form this the word hysterics comes form.
If it is one thing that the barbarians were is hysterical.

TheJoker wrote:

Everything balances themselves left unintervened.

Really?
Because last I checked the universe was tumbling towards entropic decay.

This "leave it alone it'll balance" is part of the bullshit being fed to the masses.

TheJoker wrote:

The moment you try to intervene is when balance becomes lost.

No, what becomes lost is comfort.

TheJoker wrote:

Do nothing I say. Let nature sort it out on it's own.

Very feminine perspective.
I know you think you are a rebel and shit, but that's quintessentially a conservative point of view...it is called progressive, liberal, these days.
It explains your seduction by the communist ideal, which is nothing more than Christianity for a secular, globalizing, world.

Think of this:
Change happens whether you ant it or help it along or not.
So the progressives really wish to eliminate all barriers that inhibit change. So they are the true conservatives, as they simply wish for the entropy to proceed, progress faster, as it will anyway.

TheJoker wrote:

In the end only devestation can come from it.

Funny how one day you claim to worship chaos and the next you lament about "devastation".

For me chaos is not to be shunned, contained, or even attempted to be destroyed as I view it with respect because it is the great balance of all things.

i think you are a bleeding heart liberal who's only gripe with the system is that it did not show enough compassion towards you. It is a child's bitterness towards a bad parent; one that was supposed to protect it.
You have no intellectual foundations for anything you say here. you are all emotion.

You cherry-pick through what others say and you accept the parts you think will help you.
In this regard you are not as different from the poor Dragon as you might think.

TheJoker wrote:

It is that primordial chaos and the current one of our own generation that I seek to understand or have knowledge of.

I know...because if you actually did understand it, you would not be here cheering ti on, while it fucks you up the arse, acting all tough and smug about it afterwards.

You need order, boy.
The order nobody taught you.
You stink of Dionysian drunkenness....a female psyche, not having developed beyond adolescence (because, in effect, that is what a female is), looking for someone, something to teach it how to be a man.

Σατυρ wrote:

TheJoker wrote:

Ironic how my yuppy pal?

If you study a variety of pagan religions all across the world the trickster element is a predominant archetype. It is one I can definately relate to.

The Greek Apollo or Dionysus are a bit too civilized for my liking.

I'm more of a barbarian.

This is because the Hellenes were worshipers of Apollo more than they were of Dionysus...they were a masculine civilization trying to pout the world in order with these categories.
They looked down on the Barbarians with their madness.

Dionysus had his priestesses (notice that they were female) the Hysterias...form this the word hysterics comes form.
If it is one thing that the barbarians were is hysterical.

The Greeks got their asses handed down to them by the barbarian Celts and Germans.

Even the Thracians plundered them for a time.

No disrespect for the Greeks of whom I admire but the barbarians where equally shrewd and clever.

What is order, Satyr?

Σατυρ wrote:

TheJoker wrote:

Everything balances themselves left unintervened.

Really?
Because last I checked the universe was tumbling towards entropic decay.

This "leave it alone it'll balance" is part of the bullshit being fed to the masses.

TheJoker wrote:

The moment you try to intervene is when balance becomes lost.

No, what becomes lost is comfort.

TheJoker wrote:

Do nothing I say. Let nature sort it out on it's own.

Very feminine perspective.
I know you think you are a rebel and shit, but that's quintessentially a conservative point of view...it is called progressive, liberal, these days.
It explains your seduction by the communist ideal, which is nothing more than Christianity for a secular, globalizing, world.

Think of this:
Change happens whether you ant it or help it along or not.
So the progressives really wish to eliminate all barriers that inhibit change. So they are the true conservatives, as they simply wish for the entropy to proceed, progress faster, as it will anyway.

TheJoker wrote:

In the end only devestation can come from it.

Funny how one day you claim to worship chaos and the next you lament about "devastation".

For me chaos is not to be shunned, contained, or even attempted to be destroyed as I view it with respect because it is the great balance of all things.

i think you are a bleeding heart liberal who's only gripe with the system is that it did not show enough compassion towards you. It is a child's bitterness towards a bad parent; one that was supposed to protect it.
You have no intellectual foundations for anything you say here. you are all emotion.

You cherry-pick through what others say and you accept the parts you think will help you.
In this regard you are not as different from the poor Dragon as you might think.

TheJoker wrote:

It is that primordial chaos and the current one of our own generation that I seek to understand or have knowledge of.

I know...because if you actually did understand it, you would not be here cheering ti on, while it fucks you up the arse, acting all tough and smug about it afterwards.

You need order, boy.
The order nobody taught you.
You stink of Dionysian drunkenness....a female psyche, not having developed beyond adolescence (because, in effect, that is what a female is), looking for someone, something to teach it how to be a man.

Quote :

Really?
Because last I checked the universe was tumbling towards entropic decay.

And there is nothing we can do about any of that.

Quote :

This "leave it alone it'll balance" is part of the bullshit being fed to the masses.

Not really. The masses are being spoon fed progressive socialist utopian bullshit somthing of which I do not support.

I am the man decrying dystopia to people's foolish socialist utopian ideals.

Quote :

No, what becomes lost is comfort.

Your a intervener then. What are you going to do about all of everything?

Quote :

Very feminine perspective.
I know you think you are a rebel and shit, but that's quintessentially a conservative point of view...it is called progressive, liberal, these days.

Feminine like how? I think your obssessed with using Nietzsche and Greek symbolism with everything. Such imagery can't apply to everybody and everything without understanding the general context of things.

I'm neither liberal or conservative. My philosophy if anything reaches out more towards the criminal portions of society or those that generally get categorized as being social low lives.

My philosophy is one of outcasts where I play the part of the man laughing at all of existence around me for the giant absurdity that it is.

Quote :

It explains your seduction by the communist ideal, which is nothing more than Christianity for a secular, globalizing, world.

I admit that I flirted with communism and Marxism for awhile but eventually I gave up on the prospects of it all. I've learned from my past mistakes.

Quote :

Think of this:
Change happens whether you ant it or help it along or not.
So the progressives really wish to eliminate all barriers that inhibit change. So they are the true conservatives, as they simply wish for the entropy to proceed, progress faster, as it will anyway.

All social movements for change are bullshit in my opinion.

Quote :

Funny how one day you claim to worship chaos and the next you lament about "devastation".

I said devestation would come. I didn't say anything about shunning it away.

Quote :

i think you are a bleeding heart liberal who's only gripe with the system is that it did not show enough compassion towards you.

Well I certainly disagree with the assessment that you have of myself especially when you couldn't be any farther from knowing my beliefs or perspective on things.

Quote :

It is a child's bitterness towards a bad parent; one that was supposed to protect it.
You have no intellectual foundations for anything you say here. you are all emotion.

Intellectualism is overrated although I am not entirely emotional as you say that I am.

I disagree with that prognosis you have of me.

Quote :

You cherry-pick through what others say and you accept the parts you think will help you.
In this regard you are not as different from the poor Dragon as you might think.

Is that what you think of me and my self prescribed perceivement of things?



I thought you were smarter than that Satyr.

Quote :

I know...because if you actually did understand it, you would not be here cheering ti on, while it fucks you up the arse, acting all tough and smug about it afterwards.

Why wouldn't I cheer it on Satyr?

Tell me what I'm missing out on in understanding here.

Quote :

You need order, boy.
The order nobody taught you.

I'll create my own.

Quote :

You stink of Dionysian drunkenness....a female psyche, not having developed beyond adolescence (because, in effect, that is what a female is), looking for someone, something to teach it how to be a man.

Ah, but that's where your incorrect.

TheJoker wrote:

Your a intervener then. What are you going to do about all of everything?

What makes you think that I care to do anything about everything?

TheJoker wrote:

Feminine like how? I think your obssessed with using Nietzsche and Greek symbolism with everything. Such imagery can't apply to everybody and everything without understanding the general context of things

Really?
Point to where the Greeks spoke of femininity like I do.

I wonder how "obsessed" you are with all this "I am a con-artist" bullshit.
But you'll gt your ass handed to you, in time.
The world has a way of humbling you.

TheJoker wrote:

I'm neither liberal or conservative. My philosophy if anything reaches out more towards the criminal portions of society or those that get categorized as being social low lives.

My philosophy is one of outcasts where I play the part of the man laughing at all of existence around me for the giant absurdity that it is.

Oh my poor, post-modern Diogenes...you are all and everything...and nothing all at once.
So free from reason that you can reinvent yourself, like a girl putting on makeup.

TheJoker wrote:

All social movements for change are bullshit in my opinion.

And so goes your "anarchy"
Wear it on a st-shirt.

TheJoker wrote:

The Greeks got their asses handed down to them by the barbarian Celts and Germans.

Even the Thracians plundered them for a time.

No disrespect for the Greeks of whom I admire but the barbarians where equally shrewd and clever.

I think your understanding of history is astounding.

Ebb and flow, boy.

TheJoker wrote:

What is order, Satyr?

Symmetry...beauty....knowledge...awareness...intelligence.....masculinity...

Σατυρ wrote:

TheJoker wrote:

Your a intervener then. What are you going to do about all of everything?

What makes you think that I care to do anything about everything?

TheJoker wrote:

Feminine like how? I think your obssessed with using Nietzsche and Greek symbolism with everything. Such imagery can't apply to everybody and everything without understanding the general context of things

Really?
Point to where the Greeks spoke of femininity like I do.

I wonder how "obsessed" you are with all this "I am a con-artist" bullshit.
But you'll gt your ass handed to you, in time.
The world has a way of humbling you.

TheJoker wrote:

I'm neither liberal or conservative. My philosophy if anything reaches out more towards the criminal portions of society or those that get categorized as being social low lives.

My philosophy is one of outcasts where I play the part of the man laughing at all of existence around me for the giant absurdity that it is.

Oh my poor, post-modern Diogenes...you are all and everything...and nothing all at once.
So free from reason that you can reinvent yourself, like a girl putting on makeup.

TheJoker wrote:

All social movements for change are bullshit in my opinion.

And so goes your "anarchy"
Wear it on a st-shirt.

TheJoker wrote:

The Greeks got their asses handed down to them by the barbarian Celts and Germans.

Even the Thracians plundered them for a time.

No disrespect for the Greeks of whom I admire but the barbarians where equally shrewd and clever.

I think your understanding of history is astounding.

Ebb and flow, boy.

TheJoker wrote:

What is order, Satyr?

Symmetry...beauty....knowledge...awareness...intelligence.....masculinity...

Quote :

What makes you think that I care to do anything about everything?

So your surrendering to nothing too.

Quote :

Point to where the Greeks spoke of femininity like I do.

Don't have to. Cultural sexual roles were very much assigned to the ancient Greeks when it concerned culture. Maybe it's that Greek in yourself Satyr that speaks to you.

Quote :

I wonder how "obsessed" you are with all this "I am a con-artist" bullshit.

We all have our obsessions. I have my own.

Quote :

But you'll gt your ass handed to you, in time.
The world has a way of humbling you.

Maybe it will and then again maybe it won't.

I'm a risk taker. It's where I feel the most comfortable. It makes me feel alive.

Quote :

Oh my poor, post-modern Diogenes...you are all and everything...and nothing all at once.
So free from reason that you can reinvent yourself, like a girl putting on makeup.

Reason as it exists now is a cage and tomb. I seek to slide right on through where I can feel alive rather than enslaved.

I have surpassed Diogenes.

Today's reasoning has left this world into a domesticated zoo. I seek to be wild and feral again.

Quote :

And so goes your "anarchy"
Wear it on a st-shirt.

What do you mean by this curious statement?

Quote :

I think your understanding of history is astounding.

I think it is too. Want to test me?

Quote :

Symmetry...beauty....knowledge...awareness...intelligence.....masculinity...

Sounds fancy and grandiose as descriptions. Can you go more indepth?

Keep in mind that I support patriarchy just probally not your version of it.

I do not like neither feminism or matriarchy myself as I view both as a insult to nature and men everywhere.

The world becoming dominated by both does not excite me. I view both elements as self destructive.

Σατυρ wrote:

d63tark wrote:

The fact (which almost has a kind 1+1=2 fact status) that you are..... well, Wow!

doesn't change that fact that you are using that power act like you are establishing some kind of absolute truth.

No, moron, I am establishing a precedent.
nothing absolute about it.
Past behavior is a good predictor of future behavior...once a turd, always a turd.
You can grow, but how much can a piece of shit grow?

d63tark wrote:

For instance, the notion that morality is for losers.

No, turd, YOUR morality is for losers.

There is no such thing as an amoral individual...even amorality is a moral stance.

d63tark wrote:

What are you trying to say with that?

Ummmm,t hat you are retarded?

I'll give you a strike just for being dumb.

d63tark wrote:

That it's just a bunch of people who weren't born with the same genetic privelege as you are trying to take something from you that they don't deserve. They work, consume, in order to make your daddy rich, and the daddy that had the money to get the beautiful genetic makeup that made you what you are is somehow picked on, by the losers?

I don't care about your slavishness, girl.


We all exploit one another, though some pretend not to.

I guess the problem for me, kids, is that brutality, vanity, and narcicism cannot create ideas as much as it creates alibis. And I suppose it would do me no good to tell that it does no real good for anyone. It doesn't even create beauty. So what good is it?

That said, IV, I owe you an apology. I came on here like I usually do, like it's some kind of after-bar party that I know damn well I shouldn't go to, but always end up at. Then certain resentments welled up concerning Satyr from our first encounter. And the next thing I know I'm bullying little girls. I should do better than that.

Satyr, as far as I'm concerned, I'm not sure I have anything to apologize for, but will anyway:

I regret having blindsided you like you did me, and in the process having become everything that I was critical of you for. It was hypocritical, and I'm better that.

d63tark wrote:

That said, IV, I owe you an apology. I came on here like I usually do, like it's some kind of after-bar party that I know damn well I shouldn't go to, but always end up at. Then certain resentments welled up concerning Satyr from our first encounter. And the next thing I know I'm bullying little girls. I should do better than that.

Satyr, as far as I'm concerned, I'm not sure I have anything to apologize for, but will anyway:

I regret having blindsided you like you did me, and in the process having become everything that I was critical of you for. It was hypocritical, and I'm better that.

Such a lovely child, telling himself lies to convince the world.

What I made you do is expose your "real" nature, besides that bullshit facade you've learned to play on your civility treks through an existence you wish to white-wash so that it does not burn you.

Do you know why they white-wash homes in Greece and other Mediterranean villages?
To reflect the sun. To dissipate its heat.

Now you know why I am so vile.

I don't give a shit about your civility, you moron; I care not for your respect, as it is built on lies and illusions.
I want to see YOU, you imbecile...and the best way to do that is get you flustered, your mind swimming in chemicals.

I can't get you drunk, because there, too, the true inside comes creeping to the surface, so I do the next best thing, given the medium: I get you angry.
And there you are, the true you, outside your simplistic readings of philosophy and your mundane, infantile experiences with life.

Σατυρ wrote:

Do you know why they white-wash homes in Greece and other Mediterranean villages?
To reflect the sun. To dissipate its heat.

Now you know why I am so vile.

lol

The disposable urinal, above, thinks I'm proposing anarchy....like no groups, no rules, no ideals, no principles.

More so she thinks she's "blindsided" me, you, us.
That's how romantic she is about her stupidity.

Check this out:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Narcissism, for this idiot, appears to be being humble before her retardation.
She rages against anger, when anger is a rejection of what one is, to grow, but then feels insulted when she is told what a complete moron she is...because that means someone might love himself more than they respect her sad arse.

Do you wish to see what true narcissism looks like, my dearest?
Read through this cunt's post and see how she presumes that by not loving and appreciating and respecting HER, one must be overly in love with himself.

It's as if humility before the universe or the unknown comes from giving this moron equal status...because she's obviously just as complex and deep and dark.
See THIS is Christian narcissism coming out in a more secular form.
I love it when it happens. Real-time evidence of everything I've written.

This is why I enjoy places like ILP where these douche-bags gather in droves to punch at the air with famous names, and gossip, and fart in the wind...smelling only roses.

This moron, who will now receive her third strike, because being around such filth makes my skin crawl, has convinced herself that she is so great, so deserving of respect and love and compassion and consideration, that whomever does not offer it to her, for free, must be suffering from narcissism.
He who does not love her just as much as he loves himself, or does not hate himself jsut as much as he hates her, must be narcissistic...THAT's how a narcissistic cunt thinks.
See how the ill cast their illness upon others to make their own dis-ease less noticeable?

Read this douche-bag going off, like a woman, in a forum she knows she cannot be touched, assuming that one must be overly self-flattering, to consider her a douche-bag...or hating her and her ilk means there is something wrong...with the OTHER...never her.
The idea that a nigger is hated for being an imbecile escapes the nigger's mind....because he prefers to explain it by using his race as an alibi.
Everyone who thinks he's a retard must do so because of his skin color. The nigger depersonalizes the insult.

So, this turd, comes here seeking revenge.
She almost bites my head off for asking her why she called Hitler a "shithead" here:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.].

You can feel the intimidation in her pathetic defensiveness.


I luvs my Internets.
But I love Apollo all the more.

Σατυρ wrote:

TheJoker wrote:

In the end only devestation can come from it.

Funny how one day you claim to worship chaos and the next you lament about "devastation".

For me chaos is not to be shunned, contained, or even attempted to be destroyed as I view it with respect because it is the great balance of all things.

i think you are a bleeding heart liberal who's only gripe with the system is that it did not show enough compassion towards you. It is a child's bitterness towards a bad parent; one that was supposed to protect it.
You have no intellectual foundations for anything you say here. you are all emotion.

You cherry-pick through what others say and you accept the parts you think will help you.
In this regard you are not as different from the poor Dragon as you might think.

I’m sorry, at what point in this did you show anything but emotion as compared to an intellectual foundation? I remember you using a scientific word like “entropy” and apply it in some really remote way to what progressives are after. But I don’t remember anything that actually sounded like an actual argument, just a lot of pretty talk based on the style of Lecter.

I mean you might be able to write script for Silence of the Lambs IV with this shit.

But I need a little more in this context.

d63 wrote:

But this is a double-edge sword: it also tells us that civilized people tend to kill less of ourselves. And when it comes to natural impulses, self preservation is perhaps highest among them. It requires that we be polite to one another in the hopes that the other will be polite to us.

Joker wrote:

Which is a bullshit lie put all the human wars waged in the name of civilization the last twenty five hundred years.

Need I remind you of the last two world wars?

If anything modern living is the zenith of violent expression.

And when it comes to natural impulses, self preservation is perhaps highest among them.

With all due respect, Joker, Pinker was very clear in pointing out that even with our wars, the murder rate per capita is still higher among indigenous tribes. I know it seems a little hard to believe. But you have to consider the relative size of the given populations.

It would have been pointless for him to bring it up as a counterpoint to the noble savage myth if what you're arguing were true.

Σατυρ wrote:

The disposable urinal, above, thinks I'm proposing anarchy....like no groups, no rules, no ideals, no principles.

More so she thinks she's "blindsided" me, you, us.
That's how romantic she is about her stupidity.

Check this out:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Narcissism, for this idiot, appears to be being humble before her retardation.
She rages against anger, when anger is a rejection of what one is, to grow, but then feels insulted when she is told what a complete moron she is...because that means someone might love himself more than they respect her sad arse.

Do you wish to see what true narcissism looks like, my dearest?
Read through this cunt's post and see how she presumes that by not loving and appreciating and respecting HER, one must be overly in love with himself.

It's as if humility before the universe or the unknown comes from giving this moron equal status...because she's obviously just as complex and deep and dark.
See THIS is Christian narcissism coming out in a more secular form.
I love it when it happens. Real-time evidence of everything I've written.

This is why I enjoy places like ILP where these douche-bags gather in droves to punch at the air with famous names, and gossip, and fart in the wind...smelling only roses.

This moron, who will now receive her third strike, because being around such filth makes my skin crawl, has convinced herself that she is so great, so deserving of respect and love and compassion and consideration, that whomever does not offer it to her, for free, must be suffering from narcissism.
He who does not love her just as much as he loves himself, or does not hate himself jsut as much as he hates her, must be narcissistic...THAT's how a narcissistic cunt thinks.
See how the ill cast their illness upon others to make their own dis-ease less noticeable?

Read this douche-bag going off, like a woman, in a forum she knows she cannot be touched, assuming that one must be overly self-flattering, to consider her a douche-bag...or hating her and her ilk means there is something wrong...with the OTHER...never her.
The idea that a nigger is hated for being an imbecile escapes the nigger's mind....because he prefers to explain it by using his race as an alibi.
Everyone who thinks he's a retard must do so because of his skin color. The nigger depersonalizes the insult.

So, this turd, comes here seeking revenge.
She almost bites my head off for asking her why she called Hitler a "shithead" here:
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.].

You can feel the intimidation in her pathetic defensiveness.


I luvs my Internets.
But I love Apollo all the more.

Hell, satyr, I thought she was your buddy. This totally changes every presumption I've had to this point.

That said, can I join your collosium?

I'm sorry! I thought you were talking about IV.

Nevertheless, can I still join your collosium?

And why should recieving my "third strike" concern me?

You clearly give a little more import to words than they actually warrant.

Also, I need to clear up a misunderstanding on my part. Joker, mistakingly led me to believe that you were older than me. But I now know that you are only 45. I turn 50 within the next couple of weeks which means you are little more than a punk to me. I'm just glad I now have a better sense of context.

Another question, satyr:

Why hannibal lecter?


Why not, for instance, Frank from Blue Velvet? I mean:

Heinikan!? Fuck that shit! Pabst Blue Ribbon man!

Anyway, gotta go.....


luv ya man!


You're a lot of fun.

d63tark at ILP wrote:

In other words, reality for us, has to happen in the brain, not out there. Otherwise, how could it be changed by a change in the chemistry of the brain?

I'm glad I stumbled on profound 'truths' like this when I was sixteen and drunk, rather than having to wait until I was almost fifty.

I rest my case.

It's the kind of "original" thinking this type of turd is known for, my dear Lilith.

She doesn't get what I was saying about entropy so she chooses to focus on the packaging...the style....my hypothetical intent...girlish stuff.

Fifty, huh?
Well, that means she's a genius, obviously....or is she an old-hag with the brain of a turtle?
We need an 80 year-old to tech her a lesson.

I think I'm done with her.
Release the hounds, Smithers.