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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Tue Mar 18, 2014 4:38 pm

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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Tue Mar 18, 2014 4:40 pm



Last edited by phoneutria on Tue Mar 18, 2014 4:41 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Tue Mar 18, 2014 4:41 pm

Stupid is as stupid does...and you think stupid....indeed.

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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Tue Mar 18, 2014 4:42 pm

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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Tue Mar 18, 2014 5:15 pm

There Will Be Blood wrote:
Quote :
rather than just toning it down a bit, and learning to get along within this environment, on this planet
Ain't gonna happen. War is the father of all....The monster feeds on your desire, your will to play this little game. He only exists within you. The greatest source of power in humans comes through the control & understanding of their own psychology.

If someone were to tell me about a death drive in humans, a destructive, war-like need to do violence, either on others, or when your instincts turn on yourself.....

I would not expect them also to claim that intelligence was always a good thing, by default.

.....Guess what happens when you are destructive, but have no one to play with except yourself?
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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Tue Mar 18, 2014 6:03 pm

That's really, really, really not what I meant. And I absolutely know what you thinking whilst making out the supposed meaning. Still building this caricature out of others in order to first and foremost explain things. Me? I work from the opposite direction. Which is why I rarely misinterpret, also why others find you frustrating. If you really contemplated, took my advice, then this jigsaw puzzle could be solved.


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This is until then useless. Played very nice in order to not activate any sort of defensive state, though ignorance insues in just making slight considerations. Won't respond again untill you make some valid interpetations of previous statements. Not much else to say.
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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Tue Mar 18, 2014 6:13 pm

phoneutria wrote:
Let us pollute all of our air and water on our rampant quest for domination. It doesn't matter because later we can use all of our smarts to clean it all up!! And if that doesn't work out pff simple, we will hop on a spaceship and fly to the next water hole!! duh!
LOL

Come on my dear, if nukes didn't exist you be claiming that conventional war is a global threat, or that we're all going to be wiped out by some vengeful god. Liberal pussies have been talking this shit since the dawn of time.

You've also failed to notice the huge industries we've created around recycling and environmental regeneration as well as alternative forms of energy all of which profits the West. Which ever way you cut the cake my dear, it works in the interest of the most intelligent races.

Don't let me stop you trolling though.


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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Tue Mar 18, 2014 6:19 pm

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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Tue Mar 18, 2014 6:47 pm

phoneutria wrote:
What I meant was the ultimate depletion of our star. Recycle that.

A scenario already predicted, a solution already theorized...

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Dyson Sphere

Dyson sphere is a hypothetical megastructure that completely encompasses a star and hence captures most or all of its power output. It was first described by Freeman Dyson. Dyson speculated that such structures would be the logical consequence of the long-term survival and escalating energy needs of a technological civilization, and proposed that searching for evidence of the existence of such structures might lead to the detection of advanced intelligent extraterrestrial life.

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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Tue Mar 18, 2014 7:10 pm

Less dominance, more love...

What happens when someone rejects that extended 'love'?
Those are then outside of the in-group. And as the in-group grows they push those on the outside to the periphery. But hey, they brought that on themselves by not being with the in-group. From a neutral observant point of view, there is this one group, the 'in-group' and in that example that group grows in strength and dominates the other groups. It assimilates what is willing to be assimilated and the smaller, dominated groups on the outside shrink and perish away.

And then we find members in the in-group who have the audacity to talk about the evils of dominance. What they are actually feeling is the finiteness of life-time of the dominant group which they are a part of. Either the exhaustion of resources, an overshooting effect of the growth of the group or simply entropic decay of their group-psychological-constitution. Mutations without selection pressure.

The in-group members grow restless and they have a desire to find an enemy. They start pointing fingers and are tearing out each others hairs. Fighting over what is left with typically feminine methods. A holier than thou competition.
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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Tue Mar 18, 2014 7:14 pm

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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Tue Mar 18, 2014 7:18 pm

Recidivist wrote:
Come on my dear, if nukes didn't exist you be claiming that conventional war is a global threat, or that we're all going to be wiped out by some vengeful god. Liberal pussies have been talking this shit since the dawn of time.

You were just talking about traversing the galaxy and colonizing other planets, hypocrite.

Which is a more immediate threat: nuclear weapons in the hands of terrorists, or a cosmic gamma ray exploding the earth (or whatever the fuck you were talking about)?
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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Tue Mar 18, 2014 7:21 pm

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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Tue Mar 18, 2014 7:32 pm

phono wrote:
So sweet of you to aspire to such an amazing technological future, and yet to be stuck on such primitive concepts as a political left and right.

You underestimate the size of the 'in-group' I am talking about.
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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Tue Mar 18, 2014 8:12 pm

Mo wrote:
You were just talking about traversing the galaxy and colonizing other planets, hypocrite.

Look up the meaning of hypocrisy, and learn.

Quote :
Which is a more immediate threat: nuclear weapons in the hands of terrorists, or a cosmic gamma ray exploding the earth (or whatever the fuck you were talking about)?

As I already explained to you, nuclear weapons don't constitute a global threat. Not even remotely.

phoneutria wrote:
seems to believe that the existence of a theoretic solution to a threat equals certain salvation
Conversely, seems to think the existence of a threat equals certain death.
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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Tue Mar 18, 2014 11:25 pm

There Will Be Blood wrote:
That's really, really, really not what I meant.

Then what did you mean when you said, "war is the father of all...and this monster exists within you"? I only took that to mean that humans have destructive impulses, and that these can be turned inward.

If you are going to say something novel, then get used to people misunderstanding you. It'll be common. That's not an apology though, I still think you could be clearer than you are.

Quote :
Still building this caricature out of others in order to first and foremost explain things.

You are speaking bullshit now. I don't caricature people. And what I thought you said above is something I would have agreed with.
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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Wed Mar 19, 2014 11:23 am

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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Wed Mar 19, 2014 12:11 pm

phoneutria wrote:
Is intelligence a good evolutionary strategy? Absolutely.
Should we actively breed it? Absolutely not.

We do not select. Nature does. Our job is to iterate.

I don't recall anyone advocating a eugenics program on this forum.

Since I've only ever argued that nature is indeed selecting more intelligent organisms, the evidence of this being how they are thriving, you now seem to be agreeing with this.

Or is this a case of your trolling backfiring?
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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Wed Mar 19, 2014 12:18 pm

The feminist outlook in a nutshell -

Miserable sluts living in mud huts, that's how we roll.
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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Wed Mar 19, 2014 12:23 pm

phoneutria wrote:
Is intelligence a good evolutionary strategy? Absolutely.
Should we actively breed it? Absolutely not.

We do not select. Nature does. Our job is to iterate.

Self-consciousness is nature directing itself.

What is the point of intelligence if you are not going to use it when choosing your partner?


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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Wed Mar 19, 2014 12:24 pm

phoneutria wrote:
Is intelligence a good evolutionary strategy? Absolutely.
Should we actively breed it? Absolutely not.

We do not select. Nature does. Our job is to iterate.
Are manmade environments natural ones?

Artificial/Natural, in the context of genes/memes, are defined [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]

Social eugenics are in practice.

Good luck with the rest.

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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Wed Mar 19, 2014 12:30 pm

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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Wed Mar 19, 2014 12:44 pm

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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:30 pm

phoneutria wrote:
By "we do not select", I mean that we do not decide what attributes get passed along. Nature does.
We present our iterations to Nature.
Being criterious when it comes to selecting a mate is a pretty widespread behavior among females. Some like long feathers, some like intelligence, some like V8 engines.
It should not concern us for the future of mankind if women give up their uterus based on how loud a machine can rev.
Nature will take care of all that.

It won't go well for someone who burdens themselves with worries like that. But from the tops of our heads, more loud engines means more noise.
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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:33 pm

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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:38 pm

Intelligence is not a teleos for nature....it is a means to an end.

The environment determines how much intelligence and what kind of intelligence, will pas on its genes.
In Nihilistic ones, in modern ones....it is a form of autism.


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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Wed Mar 19, 2014 9:47 pm

Quote :
You are speaking bullshit now. I don't caricature people. And what I thought you said above is something I would have agreed with.

Perhaps too harsh, but you did not bother to even guess as I assumed.

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Choose either side and in percise detail explain why. If then, no matter what side, you will have gained my respect. There are no middle grounds in this subject. Though I still maintain great appreciation for certain members within both.
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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Wed Mar 19, 2014 10:43 pm

There Will Be Blood wrote:
Choose either side and in percise detail explain why. If then, no matter what side, you will have gained my respect. There are no middle grounds in this subject. Though I still maintain great appreciation for certain members within both.

I'm on Nietzsche's side.
- I like his conception of 'truth'.
- I think the idea of an eternal recurrence provides a good guide to life, if not a cosmology.
- In general, I think we should be focused on this-worldly things, not other-wordly.
- I think there's truth, descriptively, to his account of how values are forged.

But most of all (and this is why you risk making a caricature out of yourself), I like his ability to notice subtlety, and similar influences affecting even diverse phenomena, and diverse phenomena affecting similar influences. Conceptually, you might be able to carve up the world into polar opposite categories... but in reality, things are the shade of grey that you get when you mix small elements of black and white...

Why do you think Nietzsche describes his Ubermensch as a "Caesar with the soul of Christ"?
Notice any similarities between an Eternal Recurrence model of the universe, and a Buddhist one?
Why did he say that Jesus had attributes of nobility?
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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Wed Mar 19, 2014 11:54 pm

Quote :
I'm on Nietzsche's side.
- I like his conception of 'truth'.
- I think the idea of an eternal recurrence provides a good guide to life, if not a cosmology.
- In general, I think we should be focused on this-worldly things, not other-wordly.
- I think there's truth, descriptively, to his account of how values are forged.

That was kind of dishonest. Obviously Nietzsche would have had a more coherent view of every single minutia; I added the Napleon video to further signify this. I was speaking in regards to an overall Telos.

Quote :
and this is why you are full of shit and making a caricature out of yourself

As if that's not some kind caricature-ization ironicaly. Personally I'm extremely honest if you would just trust me on that.

See we have different conceptualizations on it all, so it's hard to find equal footing.

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This is one of the greatest Christian movies ever made. I wont lie that I don't find it very soothing, appealing, etc. Just take that scene.

Then take the greatest Christian movie ever produced: The last Temptation of Christ. Pretty much because Martin Scorsese always had Nietzsche on his mind making his movies; that one being a kind of direct response. Nietzsche and Jesus having almost identical starting points in the context of the movie, with differing  solutions, conclusions, etc. If you've seen it you know what I mean. But I think you can understand the point even if you haven't.


Quote :
Conceptually, you might be able to carve up the world into polar opposite categories... but in reality, things are the shade of grey that you get when you mix small elements of black and white...

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The Universe as an eternal struggle between dynastic polar opposites. Infininte varieties of Ying & Yang. Within every single object, one always having the domination over the over.

Just answer the Telos part in great detail. Which side?
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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Thu Mar 20, 2014 12:25 am

There Will Be Blood wrote:
Just answer the Telos part in great detail. Which side?

As I said, I favour a this-wordly focus, not an other-worldly one. That tells you which side I'm on. I do not locate my telos by the light of some starry dynamo in the machinery of night. Not god's grace. Nor a noumenal realm. Not salvation. Nor cessation of anything. Whether God exists or not, I certainly don't care, and it has zero impact on how I will live. (Have you heard of the Euthyphro Dilemma? I'm clearly on one side of it).

So, as for a 'this-wordly' telos... is Nietzsche any help? Nietzsche calls the Ubermensch "the meaning of the earth". --The problem is that he says practically nothing about what an Ubermensch actually is. It's supposed to be a synthesis of master and slave qualities. The psychological complexity of a slave. The nobility of a master. Not much substantially beyond that is written.

I don't even think Nietzsche himself knew what an Ubermensch actually was. Shortly before his mind started to break, he called himself a nihilist... and I think he was right. Power is not a telos. The Ubermensch is vague. Revaluing values only begs the question. The repetition of Eternal Recurrence doesn't help. Any other ideas?

So, onward. You repay a teacher badly if you remain only a student, right? ...But you know where I look, and what side I'm on...



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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Thu Mar 20, 2014 12:31 am

Okay. Like in the Napolean video questioned though. War or Peace? Always diverge from what's actually being said. Additionally this is the second time you've re-edited idiocy because I seemingly humiliated you through it.


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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Thu Mar 20, 2014 12:50 am

There Will Be Blood wrote:
Okay. Like in the Napolean video questioned though. War or Peace? Always diverge from what's actually being said.

None of those videos are good.

It's not an either-or, as I'm trying to tell you. Buddha was conquering himself; Napoleon other people. Liberty, equality, fraternity are peaceful ideas... the 4 Noble Truths are not.

Shades of grey, everywhere.
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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Thu Mar 20, 2014 1:02 am

One urge has to dominate over the other, there is no middle ground. Personally I usually like men with an essence of war, and women with an essence of peace. So, if you had to choose one? I'm absolutley sure of the real answer, your reluctance to speak clearly on it reveals your true nature.
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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Thu Mar 20, 2014 1:09 am

If you fight for peace, which urge is dominating?

If in peace you declare war on yourself, which urge?

I do both. You tell me.
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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Thu Mar 20, 2014 1:32 am

The thing is its all self-explanatory; furtherance is just an insult.


If you don't come in accordance with own nature, then resentful attitudes are harboured in that of others, originating in that of your own.

Less appreciation of it all as seen in this outburst:
Quote :
If someone were to tell me about a death drive in humans, a destructive, war-like need to do violence, either on others, or when your instincts turn on yourself.....

I would not expect them also to claim that intelligence was always a good thing, by default.

.....Guess what happens when you are destructive, but have no one to play with except yourself?

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I know where I stand. Goal in never wishing for that earlier involvement.
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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Wed Mar 26, 2014 12:36 pm

fifi wrote:


Sorry chap, you gots ta take the good with the bad on this one.

... HOWEVER... It turns out that if you try times enough, you can spin that cosmic roulette and get something pretty amazing. A purely recessive, highly fit... beautiful, strong, smart, blonde lil sexy devil.
Why shouldn't we just keep making those?! Let's get rid of all the other ones. This is evolution here, folks! Sparkling new and improved Mankind 2.0!

Have you suffered discrimination for not being blond?

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"ἐδιζησάμην ἐμεωυτόν." [Heraclitus]

"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Wed Mar 26, 2014 12:37 pm

Mo wrote:

Apaosha wrote:
I want to replicate what I am, myself. My children would be a reflection of that.

Then fuck your sister. That's the closest you can get, right?

vs.

Mo wrote:


The only way to benefit a person is to expose a flaw in their thinking.


Recognize, a hypocrite is one who cannot apply his own reasonings to himself. Instead of exposing flaws, you use flagrant hyperbole to overwhelm an answer, and then complain, he doesn't respond.

You say,
Mo wrote:
When I ask apaosha what he values, his response is that he values himself and his genetic heritage. ---And that’s a fine answer, as far as it goes. But when you ask him what valuable qualities he finds embodied in himself and his past, he won't say; his only response is, "It's personal". People proud of themselves and their past have spent time reflecting on the values embodied in their past, and they are not afraid to stand by those in conversation with others.

What is the point of creating a public forum named "Know Thyself", when he thinks knowing yourself is only a personal project?

Pride in one's ancestry simply for being born, simply for existing, being alive, is not a value in itself?

And then you argue, about Loving your child no matter how it turns out should you have fallen in love with any third-rate creature which may possess whatever other qualities.

Do you see your contra-diction?

This, is called exposing a flaw.
"Hope I've benefitted you..."

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"All that exists is just and unjust and equally justified in both." [Aeschylus, Prometheus]

"The history of everyday is constituted by our habits. ... How have you lived today?" [N.]

*Become clean, my friends.*
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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Wed Mar 26, 2014 2:11 pm

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PostSubject: Re: Chatbox Trivialities - Race, Evolution and Aesthetics Wed Mar 26, 2014 2:24 pm

Lyssa wrote:

Recognize, a hypocrite is one who cannot apply his own reasonings to himself. Instead of exposing flaws, you use flagrant hyperbole to overwhelm an answer, and then complain, he doesn't respond.

You should have witnessed the specimen's performance in the ChatBox.

He, Moo, indulged in a childish game of infinite regress of "why?", masking as the Socratic method...and then, again as a child would, gave the only answer he could imagine would stop it: "Just Because".
Plato would be proud.
It's as far as he could go.
Very philosophical.
The "Last Man" on display...the end of thinking.

Phonee, began with the easy insinuation that her words hid a secret depth, some wealth we had to uncover - very feminine - and then, when she posted more than one sentence, she concluded in "spontaneous" appreciation of aesthetics...and the assumption of human freedom.
Now she tries to insinuate that "spontaneous" means more than it does...like Moo insinuates that the "just because" is an allusion to wisdom.  
All very Christian, including the passion of blind hedonism...the "I am not thinking, but enjoying" surrender to sensation.  

Too bad you weren't there to see it.
I erased it...it insulted my aesthetics.
Not for any other reason other than that both began with so much inflated promise, and then settled on what was most intimate to them, a flatulent release.

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