The Rage of Achilles

Diomedes is certainly a force to be reckoned with. A war hero, nearly a God to his people and he is favored among his men and his family. A true leader. I like Diomedes very much, but his story leaves out too much, the character is written just too one sided.

Odysseus... I'm going to have to get back to you on that one. It's been years since I have read the Odyssey and I'd like to re-read it before responding fully on this one. I will do that this week and get back to you.

I love literature, and the epics of Homer fascinate me, as does Beowulf. I lament the lost of the Telegony that is supposed to have followed the Odyssey, even though it was not written by Homer and only scraps of it still exist, it was still given in that same oral tradition that epic poetry like this was meant to be given.

You seem to be well-versed in the classics, Ardi. I like that; I consider my aesthetics to be classical.

I'll have to make a thread about the Odyssey sometime; another great epic.

My aesthetics are also classical. I also love discovering ancient cultures through their literature. I do not trust history books, preferring to read the literature and plays of the day to get a better idea of the interactions and reactions of the cultures in which they were set.

I am working on my Aramaic and then I will study Ancient Greek. I do know a lot of Latin, but really need to do some more work there. While I love to read different translations (I think I've read at least 7 of the Iliad translations in the last year) I would love to read them in as close to the original form as possible. It all fascinates me.

Have you read Sophocles' Oedipus the King, Oedipus at Colonus, and Antigone? I'd be interested to know what you think of Oedipus and whether or not you consider him to be a hero.

Arditezza wrote:

My aesthetics are also classical.  I also love discovering ancient cultures through their literature.  I do not trust history books, preferring to read the literature and plays of the day to get a better idea of the interactions and reactions of the cultures in which they were set.

I am working on my Aramaic and then I will study Ancient Greek.  I do know a lot of Latin, but really need to do some more work there.  While I love to read different translations (I think I've read at least 7 of the Iliad translations in the last year) I would love to read them in as close to the original form as possible.  It all fascinates me.

Have you read Sophocles' Oedipus the King, Oedipus at Colonus, and Antigone? I'd be interested to know what you think of Oedipus and whether or not you consider him to be a hero.

I haven't read those plays, but they are def. on my to-read list; however, I am familiar with the story of Oedipus. As a matter of fact, I made an entry yesterday in a thread dealing with the subtext of the story.

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I do consider Oedipus to be a hero, actually; he is an archetype of the atheist/free-thinker; he did not rely on the gods, nor tradition, to defeat the sphinx-monster. In more conventional Greek myths, monsters were killed via physical combat; but with O., he used the power of his intellect to defeat the sphinx. Unfortunately, for being an independent free-thinker, an unhappy fate befell him.

Admins., move this thread to the Agora.

My next video I'm in the process of making will be in tribute to Achilles.

It will consist of selected passages from the Iliad.

I read book 22 of The Iliad last night; one of my favorites.

The concept of fate is central to the poem. It occurred to me how much Achilles symbolized death - the inevitable fate of us all - when facing Hector. When Hector was talking to himself about whether or not he should go back inside the gates, or walk up to Achilles without any weapons, in order to make a peace treaty, it reminded me of how we try to reason with death itself, so to speak, by pretending like it will never befall us.

Hector tried to escape his fate; he ran for dear life around the city of Troy three times, until Athena tricked him, gave him false courage ( disguising herself as his brother ), and led him to his inevitable doom. This is what religions do; they give people a false sense of security, tricking them into believing that they won't die alone. But we all die alone - no man can escape the inevitable fate that awaits us all.

" No man or woman, coward or brave, can shun his destiny."

- Homer, The Iliad

This belongs in here also.

And what of Menelaus?

His wife seduced from him by a lesser man Paris akin to the modern's method of obtaining women.

How many men out there would be willing to sack the modern troy for their Helen?