Since all is in flux, and chaos is increasing, such laws are not eternal - or it is highly improbable that they are eternal, viz., that they apply to a state preceding the Big Bang or will after a order falls beneath a certain level.
But I hope you can see that the laws/constants discovered by science are long lasting enough - pretty much infinite from our limited time perspective - to make such a criticism entirely mute and not relevant to discussions about human nature?
Quote :
Chaos is random...and so organic minds cannot directly perceive it.
"Chaos theory states that within the apparent randomness of chaotic complex systems, there are underlying patterns, interconnection, constant feedback loops, repetition, self-similarity, fractals, and self-organization."
Will there ever be time when two plus two does not equal four, even in a completely choatic system? If mathematics was created rather than discovered, why has it been able to predict the existence of physical phenomena prior to its later discovery?
"Mathematics has been used to predict the existence of the planet Neptune, radio waves, antimatter, neutrinos, black holes, gravitational waves and the Higgs boson, to give but a few examples."
Satyr Daemon
Gender : Posts : 37224 Join date : 2009-08-24 Age : 58 Location : Hyperborea
But I hope you can see that the laws/constants discovered by science are long lasting enough - pretty much infinite from our limited time perspective - to make such a criticism entirely mute and not relevant to discussions about human nature?
Where have I said otherwise? Cosmic time is best measured in billions or trillions of years. Life requires but a fraction of that to emerge and develop....so organic lifespans experience some patterns and patterns underlying them (laws of nature) as eternal. "Eternity" is an organic perspective of cosmic time.
Silas wrote:
"Chaos theory states that within the apparent randomness of chaotic complex systems, there are underlying patterns, interconnection, constant feedback loops, repetition, self-similarity, fractals, and self-organization."
Chaos is defines as "complex"...and I define it as "random". "Complex order" still presumes that the entire cosmos is eternally ordered....patterned. Another way of saying "god". My positions are threatening and radical. The idea that "chaos" still means order, is comforting for organisms dependent on order, being ordering systems themselves...made of patterns.
Silas wrote:
Will there ever be time when two plus two does not equal four, even in a completely chaotic system?
No, because mathematics is but another - more abstract - language, and language is ordered and must remain self-consistent. Mathematics represent how the organic brain processes data on a fundamental level - neural systolic diastolic rhythms, viz., what is called 1, represents distole; what is called 0 represents systole. Both are matter in different phases of a process - inhale/exhale....and so Abrahamics define "spirit" as this underlying process of cellular phases. Also, "positive" refers to an neural energy pulse flowing through neural clusters - triggering actions, thoughts, memories - and "negative" refers to the same neural clusters remaining untriggered, passive... All these reduce physical processes to abstractinos.
2+2=4....once 1 has become a representation of a mental abstraction. One is the root of mathematics....and nil was added alter to negate it, as its antithesis, because the brain works on binary. The logic represents how the brain works, i.e., collects and processes data. So it will remain consistent with how it can collect and process data - sensual stimuli. Paradoxes emerge only when the representations the brain create are taken literally. Only in the mind can 2+2=5 because the mind is not limited by the physical. If mathematics remain limited by the real world - natural order - then it cannot ever take 2+2=5 seriously...just as it can't take any description of an absolute seriously, or anything that contradicts experienced existence. Square circles, ice fire, unicorns, satyrs can only exist in the mind, if it does not apply its abstractinos in real-time. So, though we can entertain the absurdity of 3+3=5, we cannot use it to create a machine, or to justify our logic. Logical Laws are how the mind disciplines itself to reality.
One is a reduction of a dynamic process to an abstraction - the most abstract. One can only represent a singular abstraction....so two represents two abstractions. Two abstractinos cannot be a representation of three. There is only one true number: one. Nil is its negation. All else are multiples or divisions attempting to represents fluidity, and since order is the only perceptible part of existence mathematics only represents patterns.
I've given my opinion on what 'abstractinos' are.
Silas wrote:
If mathematics was created rather than discovered, why has it been able to predict the existence of physical phenomena prior to its later discovery?
For the same reason language, in general, has managed to perceive the world adequately and express it and share it linguistically. Language reduces patterns to a manageable form. Patterns are energies....prediction project probabilities based on perceived patterns. Patterns are consistent, repeating, predictable ... The predictions you speak of involve multiple patterns interacting - making predictions more difficult but not impossible if you discover a pattern underlying patterns. So, insight into human behaviour - human nature - leads to predictive understanding concerning civilizations, societies, markets...
Silas wrote:
"Mathematics has been used to predict the existence of the planet Neptune, radio waves, antimatter, neutrinos, black holes, gravitational waves and the Higgs boson, to give but a few examples."
Neptune? Anyway...sometimes you find what you are looking for, and no more than that. Mathematics measures pattern interactions...patterns are consistent, repeating, predictable... Newtonian Physics is where language is most useful.
Are you saying god thinks mathematically? So, not the word but the number came first? Isn't number another symbol, like a word? An abstraction that is applicable to all and any pattern or unity of patterns?
Have mathematics predicted the existence of one? Its foundational concept....where is it? Where is this singularity? Nowhere...because like all language it is representational...and one is a representation of pattern - as a concept, that can refer to any kind of pattern.
If you want to describe the cosmos as ultimately random rather than chaotic - and claim that this is radical - you can't then go on to predict the future as some kind of eternal return with each iteration slightly differing from the last. You can't make any predictions at all. Otherwise it isn't random.
Everything you said about 1/0 relating to organic body processes sounds like new age gibberish to me. Although you have given some thought in an attempt to make it logical, it has a lot in common with postmodern narratives appropriating terms from physics. Bodily processes are analogue. Because of the success of technology metaphors using its terminology have become common, but binary is really the Base 2 number system, and its use is necessitated by the physical nature of transistor states. Prior to this it had no use in human culture and is meaningless when applied to organic systems.
Your claim that one is the only true number...In early society it was the multiplicity of things that required organising/recording and humans used their fingers hence counting in Base 10. One is no more important than any other number. It was never a case of creating pretentious abstractions - that came later with the aristocratic Athenians - but about dealing with the physical world of daily life.
What came first was geometry and the number, as there were fields, forces, energies that could be described by them and the relations between them. Pythagorus (first I think, among many) described God as a great geometer.
And the idea of unity or oneness in Abrahamic religion doesn't come from a number but observing the interconnectedness of things and the historical dissolution of polytheism.
Satyr Daemon
Gender : Posts : 37224 Join date : 2009-08-24 Age : 58 Location : Hyperborea
If you want to describe the cosmos as ultimately random rather than chaotic - and claim that this is radical - you can't then go on to predict the future as some kind of eternal return with each iteration slightly differing from the last. You can't make any predictions at all. Otherwise it isn't random.
Is that how I describe the cosmos as "ultimately random". That's what you've understood? If not absolute order, then absolute disorder, right. I can't help you escape your mental prisons.
Silas wrote:
Everything you said about 1/0 relating to organic body processes sounds like new age gibberish to me.
Does it matter how it seems to you?
Silas wrote:
What came first was geometry and the number, as there were fields, forces, energies that could be described by them and the relations between them. Pythagorus (first I think, among many) described God as a great geometer.
First came existence...dynamic interactive. All else is representational...an organism evolving a method to help it survive within this existence - help it increase the odds, the probability, of tis survival, to be more accurate - reproduction being a form of survival necessitating a sacrifice....ergo we get these sacrificial spiritualities. There is no circle, there is no line, no trinagle....no one or nil, in the cosmos...only in the mind - Platonic forms.
Silas wrote:
And the idea of unity or oneness in Abrahamic religion doesn't come from a number but observing the interconnectedness of things and the historical dissolution of polytheism.
I didn't say the idea came from the number. I said the number represents this idea and this idea comes from the mind's method of reducing the fluid to a static, complete form, by eliminating dimensions - reducing it to a manageable form. Number are like words...representational - representing mental abstractinos. Mental abstractinos are simplifications/generalizations - interrelations - of sense data; sense data is interactivity, usually involving a medium, such as light or atmosphere (air, gas). Simplification/Generalizations are a cutting away of superfluous probabilities, dimensions, data. So man evolved the perceptions necessary for the species to survive...no more than this, because brains are organs with high energy needs and efficiency increases survivability by maintain energy consumption to a minimum. Abrahamism takes the representational literally - and may go beyond this and declare the representation of reality more 'real' than the represented. Language engulfs it in a protective cocoon. This confusion produces paradoxes - linguistic in origin. This is nihilism.
That's the last time I'm going to repeat myself to you. It's "gibberish" to you..."word salad"...so why would I repeat the same action expecting a different result...that would be madness.
You can't comrpehend....it seems. The evidence suggests. Highly probable that you have some kind of deficiency. Is it inherited or cultivated? Genetic or Memetic? Physical or Psychological? Don't know...don't care.
Just believe in whatever suits you. If it works for you, then good for you.
Your need to transcend, dear. The way you define and understand it, exposes a desire to escape the real, the physical...your body, yourself. The way you define and understand consciousness - demanding that it exist before existence; out of body.
Spirit, defined as something other than mind/body. Basis of Transsexuality, and Peterson's Americanized individualism, by the way.
Peterson constricts himself by opposing transsexual rights, suing Christianity as his excuse. Transsexuals are the ultimate American individualists. They are self-made men, or women,,,,or anything. Free from collective conventions.
Transcendence. “The way you define and understand it.”
Quote my definition. Quote my understanding.
My opening post on this thread referenced a dictionary definition that popped up. My understanding of transcendence has not been posted.
Why did you write that I defined and understand it? For the spectacle? Philosophical fear porn?
Consciousness. “The way you define and understand consciousness…”
Quote my definition. Quote my understanding.
I do not understand consciousness, only working through possibilities. Scientists do not understand consciousness, but Satyr, with his vast perspective and his spot on probability calculator, does.
A gentle reminder, you tend to make up stuff in your head about me and my beliefs, what I actually haven’t written, which is all fine and well, until you go to great lengths to post that which is unfounded, ie. not true.
Of your tall(and long)tales, one of my favorites is how my curiosity about the topic of transcendence is leading to the end of the white race’s survival. A direct, obvious probability.
Meditation, centering oneself, is an aid for psychological health practiced from ancient times until now, but somehow that benign practice by Satyr’s account is leading to the downfall of Western civilization in his post after post.
If I meditate for 20 minutes, twice a day, am I perpetrating European suicide?
Satyr Daemon
Gender : Posts : 37224 Join date : 2009-08-24 Age : 58 Location : Hyperborea
Transcendence. “The way you define and understand it.”
Quote my definition. Quote my understanding.
My opening post on this thread referenced a dictionary definition that popped up. My understanding of transcendence has not been posted.
Why did you write that I defined and understand it? For the spectacle? Philosophical fear porn?
Because not defining anything is a kind of mental pornography. How is sex depicted in pronography....hyperbolic.....in whatever way gratifies individual desires but exaggerated to represents the degree of its dissatisfaction.
WendyDarling wrote:
Consciousness. “The way you define and understand consciousness…”
Quote my definition. Quote my understanding.
I do not understand consciousness, only working through possibilities. Scientists do not understand consciousness, but Satyr, with his vast perspective and his spot on probability calculator, does.
My definitions are, by definition, probabilities, not certainties.
Don't all needy slave minds fail to define their terminologies?
WendyDarling wrote:
A gentle reminder, you tend to make up stuff in your head about me and my beliefs, what I actually haven’t written, which is all fine and well, until you go to great lengths to post that which is unfounded, ie. not true.
How do you know, if you don't know of what you speak? Can an animal eve know itself, as a man can know it?
Know Thyself, dear. Clarity means you can understand, not only know. Understanding means you can simplify the complex....without ever completing your task.
WendyDarling wrote:
Of your tall(and long)tales, one of my favorites is how my curiosity about the topic of transcendence is leading to the end of the white race’s survival. A direct, obvious probability.
Not transcendence....your kind of transcendence. Your transcendence leads to the abyss....because it is unfounded....a fantasy. If man is to be "overcome"....then to what? Your solution is towards an incomprehensible, undefined, unsubstantiated, ideal that contradicts the experienced world. So, your "transcendence" is death....self-negaiton.
WendyDarling wrote:
Meditation, centering oneself, is an aid for psychological health practiced from ancient times until now, but somehow that benign practice by Satyr’s account is leading to the downfall of Western civilization in his post after post.
Hellenic asceticism, darling....not your Abrahamic asceticism. Not as an end, but as a means. Your Buddhist/Christian meditations require a sheltering group to protect you as you delve inward. Try it....see how long you survive.
WendyDarling wrote:
If I meditate for 20 minutes, twice a day, am I perpetrating European suicide?
Did I say that? Your hyperbole indicates defensive stress. The mind always exaggerates what threatens it.
Mental prisons... like the skull you mean? It's frightening stuff to think about that. What it means to imagine the brain, a grey, solid mass, entombed within a boney fortification. That's the physical reality of the situation right? I'm not being nihilistic. It's fucking medieval. That's exactly what you're dealing with though when you look at someone's head. Doctors do it everyday. An organ inside an enclosure, with a few portals to the outside world, controlling a meat and bone exoskeleton with muscle actuators. I almost drive myself mad thinking about that. Once, when I was younger, I lay on my bed trying to take full control of my unconscious nature. Trying to overcome the automated nervous system, the mechanical, fibrillating ganglia... circumvent the hindbrain so to speak. Become fully aware... of everything... to the music of Strauss' Also Sprach Zarathustra. I did it, but the cost was great. I suddenly realized that like a platoon of Russian soldiers storming a Ukrainian nuclear power plant I'd killed the automatons running the facility but had no idea how to control it myself. Terror gripped me, as I suddenly became aware of a desperate need to use the restroom. I lay on my bed but despite tremendous effort was unable to control the actuators that would move my legs. I ended up pissing myself.
Anyway, anecdotes aside, do you think Plato's allegory is really about how we are forever trapped within our own skulls? Reducing everything to the physical is usually closest we get to the truth.
At this point I'm giving up crtiquing your philosophy. You're right, I don't get it. I consider you somewhat of a Neo-Romantic with pre-Socratic underpinnings. Is that fair? But it's all too vague and hand wavy for my brutish brain. I prefer to have facts, facts that can be tested against reality. Interpretations are just too poetic and confusing. I should have been a car mechanic, or a pair of ragged claws scuttling across the floors of silent seas. But either way philosophy's not really my bag.
Satyr Daemon
Gender : Posts : 37224 Join date : 2009-08-24 Age : 58 Location : Hyperborea
Mental prisons... like the skull you mean? It's frightening stuff to think about that. What it means to imagine the brain, a grey, solid mass, entombed within a boney fortification. That's the physical reality of the situation right? I'm not being nihilistic. It's fucking medieval.
It is an additional factor in the mind/body dichotomy.
Body, endoskeleton, body exposed to the world, manifesting continuous need as interactions deplete energies and necessitate their replenishment; brain/mind encompassed by the skull, dependent on the body for tis energy needs, manifesting superfluity, and desire, i.e., a constant need to expunge excess energies.
Silas wrote:
Anyway, anecdotes aside, do you think Plato's allegory is really about how we are forever trapped within our own skulls? Reducing everything to the physical is usually closest we get to the truth.
"Anecdotes side" and then straight to Plato...Ha!!! Yes...those Platonic ideals can be thought of as the cave allegory - mind entombed in the skull - subjectivity. The fire = body energies heating it up.
Silas wrote:
At this point I'm giving up crtiquing your philosophy. You're right, I don't get it. I consider you somewhat of a Neo-Romantic with pre-Socratic underpinnings. Is that fair? But it's all too vague and hand wavy for my brutish brain.
Oh but you've only dealt with the metaphysical - which is, for me, secondary.
Silas wrote:
I prefer to have facts, facts that can be tested against reality. Interpretations are just too poetic and confusing. I should have been a car mechanic, or a pair of ragged claws scuttling across the floors of silent seas. But either way philosophy's not really my bag.
No artistry, huh? Can't say that it wasn't obvious. A mathematical brain - left-hremisphere dominates.
You can only deal with the physical. Which is primary. Trapped in the cave, as it were. You like the shadows on the walls, and don't want anything more. It suffices. Animals have no metaphysics and they get by just fine. They live in the "middle world", which is the ground. They need no metaphysics nor ideologies. They don't question what they see. They only see actions., and don't hear words. Basic.
_________________ γνῶθι σεαυτόν μηδέν άγαν
reasonvemotion
Gender : Posts : 681 Join date : 2013-01-09 Location : The Female Spirit
The simpleton claims that life itself may have been produced in some warm little pond by a process of chemical evolution and his acceptance of the big bang theory, which by the way is an incredible construct of still unproven astronomical assumptions, some of which cannot be justified on the basis of what we know from the established law of physics.
Satyr wrote
Like I've said many times: I am average in all ways...
Indeed.
Satyr Daemon
Gender : Posts : 37224 Join date : 2009-08-24 Age : 58 Location : Hyperborea
Satyr, since you’ve made this thread more about me(“Wendy Darling is bringing us healing…” “Meanwhile, as Wendy…”, and all the “you” and “your” references)rather than the exploration of transcendence, time to work through your antics.
But first, a side note. After finally reading the question you sent me, my answer is, "No. Resigned to your remaining wrong."
Motives for starting the thread: 1)I liked the sound of the word, transcendence, in my mind's eye. 2) Will Satyr allow learning to occur on a subject that is built on aspects of both science as well as spirituality? 3) Curious to know more about what transcendence means to different thinkers, people. 4)The topic hadn't already been discussed on KT. 4)I hope to transcend my limited perspective, broaden it. 5) How many types or examples of transcendence are there? 6)What benefits can be had through forms of transcendence?
Dictionary definition, opening post wrote:
Transcendence is existence or experience beyond the normal or physical level.
Satyr is wrong here...
Satyr wrote:
The way you define and understand it, exposes a desire to escape the real, the physical...your body, yourself.
Satyr's accusation, lie, is that I did not define nor understand the word, transcendence.
Dictionary definition, opening post wrote:
Transcendence is existence or experience beyond the normal or physical level.
After I stated this...
Wendy wrote:
My opening post on this thread referenced a dictionary definition that popped up...
A gentle reminder, you tend to make up stuff in your head about me and my beliefs, what I actually haven’t written, which is all fine and well, until you go to great lengths to post that which is unfounded, ie. not true.
Satyr wrote:
Because not defining anything is a kind of mental pornography. How is sex depicted in pronography....hyperbolic.....in whatever way gratifies individual desires but exaggerated to represents the degree of its dissatisfaction.
Pivoting from his accusation of the wrong definition to his accusation of no definition just to be accusatory...of something...anything, as if this thread wasn't full of all kinds of unnecessary accusations already.
Satyr wrote:
...you are an Abrahamic - spiritual nihilist.
Satyr wrote:
What an absurd notion. All life is self-conscious...
Satyr wrote:
Self-consciousness precedes consciousness...but only in humans....Why? well because. Maybe it is rooted in Dasein, as you understand the term....ha!!!
Dear....aren't you wanted back in the asylum? ILP Why did you run away from there? So many special minds there for you to share your fantasies.
Somehow you jump from this...
Wendy wrote:
I’m trying to help you. Negativity is burdensome.
Clearly, I am causing you distress so good night.
Satyr wrote:
Yes...you "got to me". you too "thumped me"....destroyed by another internet genius. Woe is me.
I posted this...[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]...a video, nothing even written, then....
Satyr wrote:
This esotericism is partially the reason why whites are committing cultural and biological suicide.
WendyDarling is bringing us "healing".....from individuation. Without meaning to she brings us a reason to no longer defend our people.
Now Satyr posts
Quote :
So while this is happening...
a video of a white man sucker punched by a black man.
Satyr wrote:
What is peace then? Death and a return to the flux....a rendering of individuation to the multiplicity. Interesting that such spirits never produce anything that will help a tribe survive in the real world, and if this practice was adopted nothing would be left of the tribe they depend upon to continue meditating.
Remember, I haven't written anything regarding transcendence yet.
Satyr wrote:
Meanwhile, as Wendy and well-meaning individuals of European descent, like her, are seeking esoteric truths and peace, and oneness, their people are being replaced and what remains of their identity is being questioned, accused and destroyed by exoteric forces that don't give a shit about their spiritual "enlightenment".
Satyr wrote:
Guilt is weaponized.
BY YOU over my posting of a few videos.
Wendy wrote:
You needn’t translate what I’ve “said” conveniently into what you mean.
In other words, stop making up stuff about me because you do not like me.
Satyr wrote:
WendyDarling is a reincarnation of an older member, and she comes and goes......always trying to proselytize me and my members. I think she considers it her sacred duty. There's also that feminine thing - erotic - of testing males, as a way of evaluating their value to her. You know....pulling at their hair, poking them, insulting them, challenging them....hoping they will overpower her (change her). Her positions and focus speaks of a desire to be changed for the better, which in her conscious mind, registers as a method of improving her already established convictions. Always looking for weaknesses to exploit... Helping me, in the process.
Who? Name the other me. I had you delete my other accounts that were inaccessible.
If I have "proselytized" as you accuse, quote ME and discuss that elsewhere.
Nothing about my interacting with you is, erotic. Another thing you made up in your head. A year or so ago, you wrote something disgusting, along the lines that my dripping, wet fingers were slipping around on my keyboard. Then, I was sparring with you, trying to be witty, for fun, tallying points, not erotic in any way. “…I know. Sick.”
Now I'd like to get back to the actual topic, transcendence. Learning.
Dictionary definition, opening post wrote:
Transcendence is existence or experience beyond the normal or physical level.
"Normal or physical" Not "normal" AND "physical"
While data or information comes into your mind through perceptions, ideas still formulate in one’s head, in the mind, which Satyr has referred to as fantasy, if lacking an external referent. Obviously, not all ideas originate through known perceptually gathered data, some are imaginings which are not automatically due to insanity as Satyr insists. Some people dream up ideas while awake and/or asleep.
Normal is defined as conforming to a standard, usual, typical or expected.
There have been and still are a great many patterns which escape normal, human perception. Some people have extra-sensory perceptions, sadly to Satyr, they are charlatans and insane rather than gifted.
Before scientific discoveries expanded across time, too few people of times passed, who were infants in science with outlandish beliefs for their times, were called witches, charlatans, and crazies.
Humans only see a fraction of the color spectrum, does that invalidate the rest of it as only fantasy? Humans can only hear a limited range of sounds, does that discount the rest of the range as only fantasy?
Science is not my religion. I have no religion, other than the religion of seriously looking into alternative ideas.
Our perceptions are limited by our physical bodies, just as our minds are limited by our brains.
The watch hour, new to me. Don’t ever remember sleeping in complete blackness, awaking to a relaxed, holding pattern of sorts state.
Satyr Daemon
Gender : Posts : 37224 Join date : 2009-08-24 Age : 58 Location : Hyperborea
Satyr, since you’ve made this thread more about me(“Wendy Darling is bringing us healing…” “Meanwhile, as Wendy…”, and all the “you” and “your” references)rather than the exploration of transcendence, time to work through your antics.
How can my "antics" fail to make it all about you, my dear?
WendyDarling wrote:
But first, a side note. After finally reading the question you sent me, my answer is, "No. Resigned to your remaining wrong."
Your generous proclamations fill my pedestrian heart with tresures.
WendyDarling wrote:
Motives for starting the thread: 1)I liked the sound of the word, transcendence, in my mind's eye.
It is the primary emotion of hedonism and the source of primal feminine mystique: if it feels right, it is right.
WendyDarling wrote:
2) Will Satyr allow learning to occur on a subject that is built on aspects of both science as well as spirituality?
Who am I to stand in the way? If 'spirituality' is defined properly, and does not acquire that superstitious bent to its penetrating shaft, even I may bend over to worship its hard interventions.
WendyDarling wrote:
3) Curious to know more about what transcendence means to different thinkers, people.
Like a psychiatrist is interested in all forms of visions and mental events. Each subjective perspective measured against an objective world.
WendyDarling wrote:
4)The topic hadn't already been discussed on KT.
True...not many women around these days.
WendyDarling wrote:
4)I hope to transcend my limited perspective, broaden it.
Can I watch?
WendyDarling wrote:
5) How many types or examples of transcendence are there?
Is not imagination released from reality not the infinite source of fantasy? Is not necessity the mother of invention?
WendyDarling wrote:
6)What benefits can be had through forms of transcendence?
I admit that the psychosomatic benefits to all forms of escapism, including chemical, are many. But what of the costs?
WendyDarling wrote:
Satyr is wrong here...
If you say so....it must be so. Logos....
WendyDarling wrote:
Satyr's accusation, lie, is that I did not define nor understand the word, transcendence.
Indeed...
WendyDarling wrote:
Dictionary definition, opening post wrote:
Transcendence is existence or experience beyond the normal or physical level. After I stated this...
Wendy wrote:
My opening post on this thread referenced a dictionary definition that popped up...
A gentle reminder, you tend to make up stuff in your head about me and my beliefs, what I actually haven’t written, which is all fine and well, until you go to great lengths to post that which is unfounded, ie. not true.
I recognize nothing 'beyond the physical' given how I define mater/energy, and spirit/soul. You speak of an esoteric experience, which is entirely subjective, and can be explained without resorting to the paranormal.
I repeat everything that exists - as an act - must find reasons within existence, otherwise anything and everything can be justified using some "beyond space/time" realm.
Wendy wrote:
Pivoting from his accusation of the wrong definition to his accusation of no definition just to be accusatory...of something...anything, as if this thread wasn't full of all kinds of unnecessary accusations already.
This is not a definition, more like an allusion:
Quote :
Transcendence is existence or experience beyond the normal or physical level.
I recognize no definition which does not use words as mediators between mind - and the ideas within it - and world - outside the mind. Connectors. What you offer are conventions with no referent. The "unusual" is always validating the usual, and the idea of a "beyond the physical" - alluding to a spiritual realm of Platonic forms - does not fall "outside" my understanding of mind/body.
Wendy wrote:
Somehow you jump from this...
Wendy wrote:
I’m trying to help you. Negativity is burdensome.
Clearly, I am causing you distress so good night.
Satyr wrote:
Yes...you "got to me". you too "thumped me"....destroyed by another internet genius. Woe is me.
I posted this...[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]...a video, nothing even written, then....
Satyr wrote:
This esotericism is partially the reason why whites are committing cultural and biological suicide.
WendyDarling is bringing us "healing".....from individuation. Without meaning to she brings us a reason to no longer defend our people.
Now Satyr posts
Quote :
So while this is happening...
a video of a white man sucker punched by a black man.
when a people lose contact with reality, they fall victim to its uncompromising, indifference. I'm trying to waken and liberate my kind form a mental parasite selling superstitions by manipulating their existential anxieties, and you....you cultivate them.
Wendy wrote:
Remember, I haven't written anything regarding transcendence yet.
Don't think I don't appreciate it.
Wendy wrote:
BY YOU over my posting of a few videos.
I apologize...I would make a bad club owner. I always ignore the cardinal rule in business: Hoes bring bros...So let it be open bar for the ladies.
Wendy wrote:
In other words, stop making up stuff about me because you do not like me.
I don't like you? You mistake respect for affinity.
Wendy wrote:
Who? Name the other me. I had you delete my other accounts that were inaccessible.
If I have "proselytized" as you accuse, quote ME and discuss that elsewhere.
It's not that you have, but that you tried.
Wendy wrote:
Nothing about my interacting with you is, erotic. Another thing you made up in your head.
Eros need not be sexual, dear. In ancient Greece the master/mentor and his student were said to have an erotic relationship.
Wendy wrote:
A year or so ago, you wrote something disgusting, along the lines that my dripping, wet fingers were slipping around on my keyboard. Then, I was sparring with you, trying to be witty, for fun, tallying points, not erotic in any way. “…I know. Sick.”
It's the kind of linguistic banter I once enjoyed, and is now falling away as mental qualities decline.
Wendy wrote:
Now I'd like to get back to the actual topic, transcendence. Learning.
Dictionary definition, opening post wrote:
Transcendence is existence or experience beyond the normal or physical level.
"Normal or physical" Not "normal" AND "physical"
I'm sure it'll be full of insights.
Wendy wrote:
While data or information comes into your mind through perceptions, ideas still formulate in one’s head, in the mind, which Satyr has referred to as fantasy, if lacking an external referent. Obviously, not all ideas originate through known perceptually gathered data, some are imaginings which are not automatically due to insanity as Satyr insists. Some people dream up ideas while awake and/or asleep.
"Insanity" is believing these fantasies are more real than the experienced world.
Wendy wrote:
Normal is defined as conforming to a standard, usual, typical or expected.
There have been and still are a great many patterns which escape normal, human perception. Some people have extra-sensory perceptions, sadly to Satyr, they are charlatans and insane rather than gifted.
Sense data is, by definition, sensory...what you describe is sense data acquired from the body, and not the sense organs, i.e., eyes, ears, tongue...
Somewhere on this board I posted something on the 'aura' - what it is, how it interacts and is senses as "intuition".
In fact, the majority of sense data remains unconscious, manifesting gut feelings, intuitions, and dreams, as the mind purges itself from them. Because they are not abstracted they become known to the mind by adopting from tis abstractinos....that's why our dreams are often strange, lacking sequence...
Wendy wrote:
Before scientific discoveries expanded across time, too few people of times passed, who were infants in science with outlandish beliefs for their times, were called witches, charlatans, and crazies.
And now charlatans exploit this factor, the unknown, to sell themselves as shamans, priests, and gurus.
Wendy wrote:
Humans only see a fraction of the color spectrum, does that invalidate the rest of it as only fantasy? Humans can only hear a limited range of sounds, does that discount the rest of the range as only fantasy?
As I've always said: The physical must be the anchoring foundation for the metaphysical.....the metaphysical cannot contradict or misalign itself form the physical. The energies we perceive as colour can be measured with ultraviolet and infrared devices. They do not contradict the colour spectrum, they extend it. And after using a scientific fact about the colour spectrum you go on and say this...
Wendy wrote:
Science is not my religion. I have no religion, other than the religion of seriously looking into alternative ideas.
I call this the Trojan Horse method. The mind uses established scientific fact to secretly introduce what contradicts science and its methodology. Nice try.
For example, another charlatan on ILP - where else - used astronomy to usher in his superstitions on astrology. Obscurantism, and occultism is how the incompatible are made "compatible" in gullible and needy minds.
Wendy wrote:
Our perceptions are limited by our physical bodies, just as our minds are limited by our brains.
Here you are tryin to exploit the [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]. I've written on it extensively. In brief...you use the absence of absolutes to introduce a secret knowledge of an absolute...or, more to your case...you use the absence of omniscience to validate the nonsensical. That method is used on ILP and in among the mediocre masses. Reason don't work that way - you build from the bottom<>up....beginning with what is perceived. The absence of knowledge and understanding is not a justification for any knowledge and understanding; you can't use ignorance to claim profound gnosis, dear.
Wendy wrote:
The watch hour, new to me. Don’t ever remember sleeping in complete blackness, awaking to a relaxed, holding pattern of sorts state.
In times of Empire collapse, superstitions nd madmen multiply in the marketplace. You can find all kinds of hustlers and madmen, claiming all kinds of things, my sweet.
When an Empire collapses it is a "world ending" event. stress levels increase, the mediocre masses begin to question everything they held to be eternal and certain....and that when snakeoil salesmen, shamans, and charlatans flourish.
