Existence...

By yes, are you confirming that existence is eternal?

?

There is only existence.
Eternal implies non-existence.
Binary.

Satyr wrote:

There is only existence.
Eternal implies non-existence.
Binary.

I'm not the one hung up on the concept of 1/0 binary. There is no zero, non-existence, no nothing. My concept is 1/infinity. The other direction away from the binary concept.

Multiples? Is your answer multiple existences?

Just existence.
There is literally nothing but existence.
Your mathematics implies binaries which is the foundation of mathematics because the mind cannot conceptualize unless it reduces all toi a thing, an abstraction.

There is only dynamic interactivity, movement, call it change....which is unceasing because the concept of a static state is the same as non-existence.

Satyr wrote:

There is only dynamic interactivity, movement, call it change....which is unceasing because the concept of a static state is the same as non-existence.

We agree on everything but what to name this state.  Logic dictates there can be no other state, which makes the idea of the singularity actually existence, balanced fluctuations that are ideal, forever.  No beginning or end, perfection.

Nor can I help it if it falls short of expectations.

I'm ready to move on to creative intelligence.

The idea of a singularity exists...yes.
Move on.
I am wrong on everything, carry on.

One reality...there it is. An absolute singularity.

There's nothing left to discuss.

Satyr wrote:

The idea of a singularity exists...yes.
Move on.
I am wrong on everything, carry on.

One reality...there it is. An absolute singularity.

There's nothing left to discuss.

The creative design.

"Creative design," yes.
A god.
I was waiting for it.

Go on.

Why so hostile about the idea of creative design?  It makes more sense than random collisions or unconscious chaos forming complex systems.  More sense than chaos suddenly deciding to become order.

If we note a book does not build itself, why not extrapolate that to other things that have always existed in various states of "completion" or call it simply progress?  Energy didn't start out of nothing.  It always existed, simply changing patterns. While several types of energy exist, our current set up cannot detect all that's there, especially if the states of energy may be fluctuating into completely different patterns of energy beyond what temperature changes do to matter.  

Could every possible dimension be revealed? Could every "atom"(Is there a better word for that?)be counted?

A complex system consists of patterns than are immeasurable and has intricacies that coordinate with other complex systems to form what we see and don't see as change.

So, it was never I who claimed to know the absolute, but you, YOU!!!
Typically Christian...accuse the other of what you are most guilty of.

So, you know the absolute truth, and it is perfect - are you perfect?
You know there's a singularity - it is "logical no? - and it is the word....singularity.
You know this because you know ALL, and all is a singularity, a singular concept encompassing, all multiplicity.
and since such perfection, as you, can never arise accidentally, it must be the product of a will, a creator....who exists outside creation...so the singularity is a duality, now...

I now know why you stayed on ILP for so long...another gifted, chosen, one, who will save the world.

Listen Nat, when did you move out of Florida?
Was it Nicholas?
Did the demons stop harassing you when you rediscovered god?

Satyr wrote:

So, it was never I who claimed to know the absolute, but you, YOU!!!
Typically Christian...accuse the other of what you are most guilty of.

So, you know the absolute truth, and it is perfect - are you perfect?
You know there's a singularity - it is "logical no? - and it is the word....singularity.
You know this because you know ALL, and all is a singularity, a singular concept encompassing, all multiplicity.
and since such perfection, as you, can never arise accidentally, it must be the product of a will, a creator....who exists outside creation...so the singularity is a duality, now...

I now know why you stayed on ILP for so long...another gifted, chosen, one, who will save the world.  

Listen Nat, when did you move out of Florida?
Was it Nicholas?
Did the demons stop harassing you when you rediscovered god?

You are incapable of exploration?

Oh, that's right. It has to come from a "reputable" book or documentary to fit your bill.

Sweetie...since my KillDevilHill years, into sciforums and then ILO and then PhilosophyNow, ILP, I've been "exploring" this one-god delusion.

How many decades will I have to explore the same bullshyte from the same kinds of minds using the same "arguments"?
At some point I said "fuck it"....and promised myself not to repeat those frustrating battles with simplicity.
You want to believe in your "creator one-god" go right ahead....did I bother you, did I try to stop you?
No.
Are you here to proselytize me?
Good fuckin' luck.

Did the meme urge you to seek converts to "save your needy soul" or "prove your worthiness" to your master?


By the way, duffus...a 52 year old woman would never call a 55 year old man "old" because she feels her own age more harshly than any male ever can. Men age well, simpleton, women not so much.....and you know it.
Just some advice when you try to fool me next time.

Phoney did the same shit... used her own growing insecurities concerning her age and loss of beauty, as weapons she thought would hurt me...
You share the same desire to prove intellectually worthy of attention.

Satyr wrote:

Sweetie...since my KillDevilHill years, into my sciforums and then ILO and then ILP, I've been "exploring" this one-god delusion.

How many decades will I have to explore the same bullshyte from the same kinds of minds using the same "arguments"?
At some point I said "fuck it"....and promised myself not to repeat those frustrating battles with simplicity.
you want to believe in your creator one-god" go right ahead....did I bother you, did I try to stop you?
No.
Are you here to proselytize me?
Good fuckin' luck.

Did the meme urge you to seek converts to "saver your soul" or "prove your worthiness" to your master?


By the way, duffus...a 52 year old woman would never call a 55 year old man "old" because she feels her own age more harshly than any male ever can. men age well, simpleton, women not so much.....and you know it.
Just some advice when you try to fool me next time.

Phoney did the same shit... used her own growing insecurities concerning her age and loss of beauty, as weapons she thought would hurt me...
You share the same desire to prove intellectually worthy of attention.

Well, I haven't spent most of my life on the internet, so pardon me for "going there."  Wouldn't ya rather  be doing something else than getting angry and spitting venom?  This is the only thread here?

I never "spit venom"...my honestly feels acidic to your delicate skin.
Accusing me of your own guilt was your acid...your mind games.

I never came on ILP to convince you not to be delusional, because I know that you cannot survive without it.
It would kill you if there were no god.

WendyDarling wrote:

Well, I haven't spent most of my life on the internet, so pardon me for "going there."

Know what's funny, sweetie...I own a home and have a son....
I've served in the army, travelled so much I've grown sick of it....

What about you?

My current solitude is my retirement.
My vacation from the world of men and women.
No more rat race.

Satyr wrote:

I never "spit venom"...my honestly feels acidic to your delicate skin.
Accusing me of your own guilt was your acid...your mind games.

I never came on ILP to convince you not to be delusional, because I know that you cannot survive without it.
It would kill you if there were no god.  

Do you consider your angry delusions, of scraping around for hurtful ammunition, just to silence someone who is trying to explore the nature of existence noble? Virtuous?

Saying something is "logical" or "true" or a "singularity" or an "absolute" does not make it so....doers not increase the probability of it being so...no more that I claiming to be immortal...or Ecmandu ending his insane tirades with "it doesn't work that way"./
Words.

I've posted mountains of words explaining how words are validated by reality....are made more probable.
I will not retype them all for you.

He too...

...is "exploring existence"....
Do I need to engage him to know that he's a troubled mind?
ILP is there, dear...you can always go back and explore reality there.

Those days we had together were nice, until you started saying insane shit...
I had to bail out before the crazy affected me personally.
No harm intended. You are a nice person, all in all.
But crazy is unpredictable, and I am Apollonian.

Satyr wrote:

Saying something is "logical" or "true" or a "singularity" or an "absolute"  does not make it so....doers not increase the probability of it being so...no more that I claiming to be immortal...or Ecmandu ending his insane tirades with "it doesn't work that way"./
Words.

I've posted mountains of words explaining how words are validated by reality....are made more probable.
I will not retype them all for you.

Am I forcing you to continue hurling accusations?  Others who may not have explored all of existence so that their mountains of words describe everything as accurately as you may be inclined to enter this thread or not. Are you being forced to read this thread? Am I making myself look as unreasonable as you?

If I am to be the only participant in this thread, it's definitely going to be expository rather than my bringing evidence at this point.

For simplicity's sake, energy makes up the organic, biological world/space.  Throwing out another concept "idea." We have identified common types of energy, but the mystery still surrounds the concept of spooky action at a distance as well as a lot of other weird, quantum physics anomalies.  Connectivity via a second type of energy we have yet to identify, intricate webbing that not only connects every wave of energy here but ties it into "spaces" or dimensions we have yet to uncover as readily as this one.  The second type of energy connects every miniscule change so there is a cohesive crossover which we accept as change in the passage of time.

What I always find interesting about experiments and  supernatural testimonies is that no two are even close to being "identical."  Our entire premise of experimentation that it is repeatable producing the same/similar results doesn't make sense to me logically. How is that possible when an infinite magnitude of change has occurred?

I understand that time is cyclical here, but that may not necessarily be true in other dimensions.

Jumping around a bit. Energy never stops being energy.  What is death when energy never stops being energy, only a changing of the primary pattern, but what of a secondary energy, its prevalent pattern?  NDEs defy a lot of scientific ideas about not only the biological system, but also vivid memories being retained in a system essentially shut down for hours in some cases. This is my primary reason to believe in a secondary system of energy. Another thing I find fascinating is that just as nothing we experience or understand is identical, those who crossover never report identical experiences or continuity of travel to reach the other dimension where the far side of their near death experience unfolds. Continuity of memory is impossible in a dead biological organism, so how are these experiencers able to hear and see their immediate surrounding around where they lay dead with their eyes closed, their brains off?

Death refers to organisms...many patterns participating in its unity.
Death means the dissolution of this unity of many energies, patterns, and, more importantly of memories.
The loss of memories is what death is.

But you believe in the soul, eternal memories.
You deserve to be preserved forever....how humble.

Satyr wrote:

Death refers to organisms...many patterns participating in its unity.
Death means the dissolution of this unity of many energies, patterns, and, more importantly of memories.
The loss of memories is what death is.

But you believe in the soul, eternal memories.
You deserve to be preserved forever....how humble.

Existence is...not going anywhere only changing vehicles of energy, especially concerning consciousness since it doesn't disappear or end.  Continuity of memory is something I find fascinating.  The tv series, Surviving Death season 1, covered some pertinent ground(with a few charlatans when they visited psychics near the end of the series) with children reporting at very young ages(2-5 yrs old.) memories of a deceased person as if they lived the lifetime of another already, were another already.  If it were adults, I'd be more skeptical, but when it's overwrought parents trying to help their children be children without those vivid, detailed recollections, I give those more weight, especially when the reports are investigated and tested.  But even if secondary vehicles of energy end up being recycled, that's not definitive of a loss of memory continuity, could be an echoed trace of the last participant of secondary energy before another transference, another connective energy.  Could the "matrix" of energies be infinite?

There are no vehicles.
The body is not a vessel for a soul.
The body is you.
There is no you without the body.
Body is past manifested as presence.

Soul = body mind synthesis.
Spirit the continuity of memories stretching further than your conception, the moment two continuums merged into you.
Sorry...no eternal life.

Your memories through procreation - DNA - and then only partially...or memetically if you leave writings of your thoughts...

WendyDarling wrote:

...the singularity. Also known as the absolute.

Kant's Ideal of pure reason, coincides with how reason is meant to be disciplined/ordered. I'm with him in understanding the affinity of singular cognizing of existence, in that it must have its place within reason and what it tends towards, as a relation to experience. Reason and the mind, is in a constant state of ordering of existence, and depending on the quality of the mind, this ordering strives toward a form of absolution or completion. The stronger the mind, the more precise it will attempt to be at this effort. This is actually a mark of genius. The more perceptual data, details and material impressions, knowledge, etc that a mind is able to incorporate into itself and process, the more possibilities and approximations of completion it will then be able to discern in existence and seek to find an ever-greater degree of order. But this can then extend into the realm of illusion, because then reason loses touch with the world, and thus loses its connection to the self-awareness of the drive toward an ideal, so if one becomes entangled within a certain idealized state, stunted in it, then their potential to approximate degrees of awareness reaches its threshold, if it cannot discern any further from nature, than it will invent conceptualized machinations for itself to compensate; it reaches a point of weakness in other words. The absolute can be defined as a form of intellectual ‘striving towards’ becoming, and never being, but timelessly interacting with it, merging with it as an interaction, and evolving, changing with every point of interaction where a new degree of awareness is reached. Perhaps think of ideals in terms of the multiplicity/plurality where flux finds ‘points’ of order and cohesion, but that cohesion is determined by its entropic process and its entropic process is determined by the strength and quality of its cohesion, its own tolerance for the pressure of regress and how well it repels decay, i.e health, fitness. The idea of the absolute, is such a form of cohesion, but as a mental construct only which attempts to unify existence in a model, a paradigm of understanding. And this unification is an ideological structure of that same striving towards completion, only to be subjected to another degree of lapsing, and this is exactly what suffering is, and why it's important for producing change and creation, the survival of consciousness. Heraclitus’ fire, is perennial movement, and his understanding of ‘unity of opposites’, is perhaps the closest we can come to appreciating some semblance of what the “absolute” is in terms of its Kantian use in transcendental logic.

Heraclitus wrote:

The unlike is joined together, and from differences results the most beautiful harmony

Kant wrote:

Nature considered materially is the totality of all objects of experience

If we appreciate the absolute as it is, a purely subjective idealized product, thus it can, more suitably, aid us in the endeavor of self-knowledge only, and where our needs and motives comes from in terms of interpreting existence in relation to our own.

Satyr wrote:

Death refers to organisms...many patterns participating in its unity.
Death means the dissolution of this unity of many energies, patterns, and, more importantly of memories.
The loss of memories is what death is.

But you believe in the soul, eternal memories.
You deserve to be preserved forever....how humble.

How do you account for people gaining full consciousness, completely unscathed after their body has been without electrical activity and the brain without oxygen for hours?

Internet utility is so compromised with bull that it's hard to present credible evidence for anything these days.

#1 Do you believe every story you hear on-line or out there if it agrees with your delusions?
#2 I would need to see the details to give my theory.
#3 Consciousness - energy flow - never stops if there is life. It falls to imperceptible levels. The body is also part of consciousness.
The brain is the hub of the nervous system and the nervous system is the synthesis of mind/body.

The internet is full of bullshyte indeed.

How do we validate a claim?
In reality.
First hand observation validate or falsify second hand accounts.
Another factor. The source's credibility based on tis past performance.

Listen, you don't need to convince me or anyone, believe whatever makes you feel good.
You ain't a philosopher, just an average person doing the best she can.
Simpler minds need such superstitions to help them cope.

WendyDarling wrote:

Satyr wrote:

Death refers to organisms...many patterns participating in its unity.
Death means the dissolution of this unity of many energies, patterns, and, more importantly of memories.
The loss of memories is what death is.

But you believe in the soul, eternal memories.
You deserve to be preserved forever....how humble.

Existence is...not going anywhere only changing vehicles of energy, especially concerning consciousness since it doesn't disappear or end.  Continuity of memory is something I find fascinating.  The tv series, Surviving Death season 1, covered some pertinent ground(with a few charlatans when they visited psychics near the end of the series) with children reporting at very young ages(2-5 yrs old.) memories of a deceased person as if they lived the lifetime of another already, were another already.  If it were adults, I'd be more skeptical, but when it's overwrought parents trying to help their children be children without those vivid, detailed recollections, I give those more weight, especially when the reports are investigated and tested.  But even if secondary vehicles of energy end up being recycled, that's not definitive of a loss of memory continuity, could be an echoed trace of the last participant of secondary energy before another transference, another connective energy.  Could the "matrix" of energies be infinite?

Where there is no consciousness, there is no order.  The concept of chaos makes less sense than its actualization, the nature of its affect, change.  Makes me see the action of existence as a chimera.